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Multi-cal system problem communicating with DUT's

Other Parts Discussed in Thread: PGA309, PGA308

I have a DAQ board connected to a multi-cal master board with two PGA0308 evaluation boards on the interface board.

All cables seem correct

I have them set for 4 wire voltage mode, and I select the 4 wire voltage mode model in the software.

my supplies are on, the +9V to the DC jack, the USB is plugged in, the

15/-15V and 5V that supplies the DUT and these are supplied to J9 on the multi-cal master PCB

Under the debug tab, I play with the mux setting, and the corresponding  LED's light up, and under the debug tab I can affect dut power LED on the DAQ board with the GUI switch.

but when running the "test" or the "calibration" TAB my modules always report in the window "communications error"

I can't find a full schematic to the multi-cal master board, only the user manual.

When under the debug tab, I select the mux and the LED lights. but  the opto-relays on the slave do not pass

DUT power (+5V) to the DUT's (my PGA0308) module.  The LED side of the opto's are not being brought to ground to turn the

opto relays on.

I am suspicious that the I2C or something else isn't working.  I have not yet gotten out my scope to start probing I2C local to the DAQ board (hey it's the weekend!)

But I am sure something is simple wrong that I am over looking, a jumper setting someplace?

Also, is there a power supply sequencing that is recommended?

  • Hello Brett,

     Thank you for the description of your setup and test environment.  Would you be willing to construct a block diagram of all the pieces in this system, showing also the cables, the connectors to which they are connected, and all other connections.  That would be very helpful.

    Thanks,

    ~Leonard

  • How am I to share a diagram? is their a special way to do that on this board?
  • Yes, after  you click Reply, click the Use rich formatting, in the lower right corner of the box.  This gives you a toolbar at the top of the Reply box.  Click on the paper-clip to INSERT a graphic file into the reply.  I used this feature to compose this Reply.   

  • Right out of the box, I decided to try the 4 wire model from the EVM software , no Power supply script,
    so I turn on the +/-15V and the 5V which leads to UUT power manually and then run the calibration,
    but these modules never reply; communications error is all that I can get on the calibration line for any module.

    I am not sure if the UUT is getting powered or not; if it is not then it will not answer via the OTP
    I did not get a chance to scope the UUT's power rails at the opto-relay today.
    I will tomorrow.
  • Hello Brett,

    Thank you for sharing these images. When you attempt a calibration using one of the standard model/pre-cal files, does the "Vdut" LED on the USB DAQ Platform PCB ever illuminate? This indicates that the +5V/3.3V supply to the PGA309 is on, and without it the device can not communicate.

    There's no critical power supply sequence, just make sure the +5V bench supply, +/-12V bench supply, and 9V wall wart supply are all powered on.

    Best regards,

    Ian Williams
    Applications Engineer - Precision Amplifiers
  • Yes it does.. it's interesting though, the led does not shut back off. I looked at the USB "Debug" window and it looks like the slave board I2C are Acking back. I am going to start from a fresh of the install in case some how the model was modified (I am new on the project) this Cd I have is October 27, 2010.. so thats proabably outdated.
  • when I meant "slave" board I meant the master board. The Vdut light on the Daq board (after the cal sequence) does not turn back off and the Mux light for the first DUT stays on.. It says the cal is finished however (the software) If I decide to quit the program (hit the X) I get a crash on the way out and a complaint of the DLL being unloaded. So I am thinking this software version I have is old.. or the firmware on the DAQ board is old?
  • Well it seems that installing the latest multi-cal system software download on another computer seems to have gotten me communicating with both UUT modules (these are PGA308 modules),

    My HP33401A meter now reads a voltage which I am presuming is Vout  as well... 2.49675 Vdc is all it has appeared to read.  

    Here is a picture  of what shows o n the screen after the calibration

  • Actually the meter looks like it reads two points near 2.5V  !first 2.4 then 2.8V.

    I will review the documentation and scripts a bit more and see if perhaps the evaluation modules jumpers are not set to what this 4 while example

    without modification is requiring, it could be that the jumpers are off from what the example demands.

    My goal is to get one evaluation module to pass it's example calibrration flow so that I can be more confident in understanding the scripts and software before attempting my own modified scripts ect.

  • Ian,

    Is their perhaps documentation for this Multi-cal software that explains the flow and scripts in more detail that I have overlooked? Or perhaps it is on the CD (which is from 2010!)
  • Hello Brett,

    The hardware portion of the Multi-Cal System is well documented in its User's Guide, but unfortunately the software is not.

    The DMM readings you're observing around 2.5V are correct, as initially the system sets the PGA308 output to two values near mid-supply in order to back-calculate the initial bridge voltage. It seems like the software configuration of the DMM is not correct, so those voltage measurements are not being fed back into the software.

    Are you using a GPIB or RS-232 interface between the DMM and the PC? Also, exactly which model file and pre cal file are you using in this test?

    Best regards,

    Ian Williams

  • Hello Ian,

    0. Yes, I see that.. even installing labview and loading the project (which I had hoper may had uncovered code documentation did not help.)

    answers to your questions:

    1. I am using the RS-232 interface and that specific meter script file, which I believe is within the user manual. The meter front panel is reporting those voltage values. There is a audible beep every time the meter is acquisitioned via the multi-cal software, and the "ERR" indicator is illuminated on the meter front panel. so your suspicions I believe may be correct; the values are not getting to the software. I will post the errors after I manually retrieve them via the front panel, also I will recheck the meter's RS232 settings and re-reference the meter script file shortly. (Tuesday june 6th)

    2. Specifically, to answer your query; I am using the 4 wire model and what ever pre-cal files and post cal files were within that model; I have not modified any setting or file after the fresh software install. That being said, I think the jumper settings for the stimulus points, may defer from the "out of the box" pre and post cal files that came with the latest software install.

    Any ideas why the meter could be experiencing errors? It's odd that the stop bits within the script say "20" and that means 2 stop bits? is there somehow a modification to this script file that needs to occur?
  • Continuation:

    Hi Ian, here is the model, the meter script, and the pre-cal that the model uses.

    I have not modified them from the install, perhaps there is something amiss in them.

    Model:

    Vout_4_wire.csv  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    [PRO CAL CFG]
    IEEE488 Address=GPIB0::2::INSTR
    Meas Instrument=2
    Pre Cal File=/C/Documents and Settings/a0872662/My Documents/Lab View Projects/Multi_Sensor_EVM/Pre_Cal/pre1_voltage.csv
    Load Pre Cal=TRUE
    Run calibration=TRUE
    Post Cal File=/C/Documents and Settings/a0872662/My Documents/Lab View Projects/Multi_Sensor_EVM/Post_Cal/post1_v.csv
    Save Cal Results=FALSE
    Write Report=FALSE
    Load post cal=FALSE
    Program OTP=FALSE
    Run post cal varification=FALSE
    Report Root=RPT_MOD1
    Cal Results Root=CAL_MOD1
    Mux Size=16
    Last Part Tested=1874
    Pause=TRUE
    Tolerance=0.100000
    Pressure Script File=<Not A Path>
    DMM Script File=/C/Documents and Settings/a0872662/My Documents/Lab View Projects/Multi_Sensor_EVM/DMM_Scripts/Voltage_34401_rs232.txt
    Supply Script File=<Not A Path>
    Model Number=11
    Soak Time=30.000000
    Fast Scan=TRUE

    voltage_33401_rs232.txt >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    RS232_COM_port>1
    write>SYSTem:REMote
    pause>2.0
    parity>0
    baud_rate>9600
    num_bits>8
    flow_control>0
    num_stopbits>20
    term_char>10
    write> MEAS:VOLT:DC? 10,0.00001
    pause>2.0
    read_dbl> 64

    pre1_voltage.csv >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    [PGA308_Config]
    Vs=5.000000
    Vref=4.096000
    Output_MODE=0
    Target_Max=4.000000
    Target_Min=1.000000
    Reg 0=0
    Reg 1=0
    Reg 2=0
    Reg 3=0
    Reg 4=256
    Reg 5=0
    Reg 6=0
    Reg 7=0
    Reg 8=0
    Reg 9=0
    R1=0.000000
    R2=0.000000
    R_ref=0.000000
    xtr_Vref=0.000000

  • Hi Brett,

    The DMM script looks good, and its settings match my file which I know works with an RS-232 connection.  Here are some things to check:

    • Is it a true RS-232 cable or a RS-232-to-USB device?
    • Does your COM port number in the very first line of the DMM script file match the actual COM port setting in Windows?
    • What kind of DMM are you using, and do its RS-232 settings match the script file?

    Best regards,

    Ian Williams

  • The meter presents the following error -410 as if  a command  was requested of the meter

    out of sequence.

    I think it is partially  working, since it actually goes into remote,

    and actually ranges and appears to acquisition.

    1. It is the 33401 meter as per the operators manual example using a serial interface

    2. I am using a USB to serial adapter (prolific usb to serial adapter)  I have confirmed that this adapter works since I use it on another project.

    3. The settings under device manager for the USB to serial port are

    COM1, 9600 baud, no parity, 8 bits data, 1 stop  bit, no flow control

    4. The meter settings as I page through it's menu's are as follows

    interface( RS232)

    Baud( 9600)

    parity(  NONE: 8 bits)

    Language( SCPI )

    I do not see menu settings that describe termination characters or flow control options

  • Ian, stop bits in the script says (20)

    is that 2 stops bits, 20 stop bits, ?

    perhaps that is wrong?

    RS232_COM_port>1

    write>SYSTem:REMote

    pause>2.0

    parity>0

    baud_rate>9600

    num_bits>8

    flow_control>0

    num_stopbits>20

    term_char>10

    write> MEAS:VOLT:DC? 10,0.00001

    pause>2.0

    read_dbl> 64

  • Hi Brett,

    Try changing "num_stopbits" to 10. I took a look at some other DMM scripts made for RS232-to-USB devices and that's the value used. Looking at the 34401A manual, the DMM uses 1 start bit and 2 stop bits. 2 in decimal is 10 in binary, so perhaps that field is interpreted by the DMM in binary.

    Best regards,

    Ian Williams

  • Ian,
    I made the change you suggested, but unfortunate I still have similar results.

    I am going to see if I can borrow a USB-GPIB-BUS converter and try the GPIB -BUS. for the meter.
    and use the meter script file with the GPIB settings as intended for the purpose.
    In this way, all of the instruments in use
    can just communicate through the same means.

    The end goal is to communicate with a stimulus device as well.. (i.e. the pressure script)
    and I will also need to communicate with the supply that powers the UUT (i..e. power supply script)

    from a system perspective, just using one interface; the GPIB bus will be less problematic for long term maintenance of our calibration setup, and hopefully.. it get's rid of my serial port demons.
  • Hi Brett,

    One other thing you should check is the pinout of your cables and the connector on the DMM. Sometimes the TX and RX pins are switched, forcing you to use a null modem cable or adapter. I've definitely had that happen when trying to use similar equipment.

    In general, the GPIB-to-USB devices work very easily, so that should alleviate this issue if you can get your hands on one.

    Best regards,

    Ian Williams
  • Hi Ian,

    The Usb to GPIB worked like a champ...

    I finally got through a Cal and passed and the OTP's were written! Thank you for your help..

    now I am actually getting someplace and am able to generate better questions:

    1..

    During the calibration

    The multi-cal program told me in pop up boxes that my pre-cal and posty-cal files had the "wrong path"

    so I clicked okay.  even though, I do not see away to set the path for the pre and post cal files.

    3.

    Things are looking good (see logs of two units below )

     my next step is that I just want to "verify" them without calibrating them and writing to them.

    That is, just power em up would just verify them according to their written calibration data in the OTP

    is that the notion of post-cal?.

     

    4. Do you know if there is an API for the DLL that controls the Multi-cal system? 

    That is, if I wanted to use something like C# or visual basic to make my own program, I think I would need

    documentation on the DLL that is running the DAQ system and the Master/slave boards.

    Sensor Report

    General Info
    Sensor Pass/Fail = Pass
    Serial Numberl = 2123
    Sensor Channel = 0
    Date of calibration = 6/9/2017 5:09 PM
    Sensor Output Min = 1.000754E-3
    Sensor Output Max = 3.033406E-3
    Module Output Min = 1.000055E+0
    Module Output Min = 1.000055E+0
    Module Error Min = 0.003%
    Module Output Max = 4.000392E+0
    Module Error Max = 0.013%

    Reg Set
    Reg 0=35.947000E+3
    Reg 1=34.224000E+3
    Reg 2=27.392000E+3
    Reg 3=0.000000E+0
    Reg 4=256.000000E+0
    Reg 5=33.251000E+3
    Reg 6=33.251000E+3
    Reg 7=257.000000E+0
    Reg 8=0.000000E+0
    Reg 9=0.000000E+0

    Gain and Offset
    Vs = 5.000000E+0
    Vref = 4.096000E+0
    Front Gain = 600.000000E+0
    Output Gain = 3.600000E+0
    Coarse Off = 0.000000E+0
    Gain Dac = 683.288539E-3
    Zero Dac = -193.909209E-3

    File Names
    Pre Cal = pre1_voltage.csv
    Post Cal = post1_v.csv
    Report File Name = CAL_MOD1_MN_11_SN_2122to2138_DT_2317.txt
    Cal File Name = CAL_MOD1_MN_11_SN_2122to2138_DT_2317.txt


    Sensor Report

    General Info
    Sensor Pass/Fail = Pass
    Serial Numberl = 2124
    Sensor Channel = 1
    Date of calibration = 6/9/2017 5:09 PM
    Sensor Output Min = 1.010564E-3
    Sensor Output Max = 3.048417E-3
    Module Output Min = 1.000189E+0
    Module Output Min = 1.000189E+0
    Module Error Min = 0.007%
    Module Output Max = 3.999789E+0
    Module Error Max = -0.007%

    Reg Set
    Reg 0=35.947000E+3
    Reg 1=34.224000E+3
    Reg 2=27.392000E+3
    Reg 3=0.000000E+0
    Reg 4=256.000000E+0
    Reg 5=33.251000E+3
    Reg 6=33.251000E+3
    Reg 7=257.000000E+0
    Reg 8=0.000000E+0
    Reg 9=0.000000E+0

    Gain and Offset
    Vs = 5.000000E+0
    Vref = 4.096000E+0
    Front Gain = 600.000000E+0
    Output Gain = 3.600000E+0
    Coarse Off = 0.000000E+0
    Gain Dac = 681.477830E-3
    Zero Dac = -198.721782E-3

    File Names
    Pre Cal = pre1_voltage.csv
    Post Cal = post1_v.csv
    Report File Name = CAL_MOD1_MN_11_SN_2122to2138_DT_2317.txt
    Cal File Name = CAL_MOD1_MN_11_SN_2122to2138_DT_2317.txt

     

    Here is the other file

     

    [channel0]
    Vin min=0.001001
    Vin max=0.003033
    channel=0
    Reg0=35947
    Reg1=34224
    Reg2=27392
    Reg3=0
    Reg4=256
    Reg5=33251
    Reg6=33251
    Reg7=257
    Reg8=0
    Reg9=0
    Front Gain=600.000000
    Output Gain=3.600000
    Coarse Off=0.000000
    Gain Dac=0.683289
    Zero Dac=-0.193909
    Vout min=0.999842
    Vout max=4.000028
    Serial No.=2123
    Date Stamp=2317
    Date / Time="6/9/2017 5:09 PM"
    Pass=TRUE
    [channel1]
    Vin min=0.001011
    Vin max=0.003048
    channel=1
    Reg0=35947
    Reg1=34224
    Reg2=27392
    Reg3=0
    Reg4=256
    Reg5=33251
    Reg6=33251
    Reg7=257
    Reg8=0
    Reg9=0
    Front Gain=600.000000
    Output Gain=3.600000
    Coarse Off=0.000000
    Gain Dac=0.681478
    Zero Dac=-0.198722
    Vout min=1.000223
    Vout max=3.999718
    Serial No.=2124
    Date Stamp=2317
    Date / Time="6/9/2017 5:09 PM"
    Pass=TRUE

  • Hello Brett,

    I'm glad the GPIB-to-USB interface worked for you!

    1) The pre-cal and post-cal file paths are controlled by the model file. In the "Configure Cal" tab, you can create and edit pre-cal and post-cal files which can then be loaded into a model file. If you click the button to create/edit the sensor model configuration, in the window that pops up you can select your desired pre-cal and post-cal files. That should correct any "wrong path" errors.

    2) The post-cal file works as an automated test and verification of the calibrated settings that have been written to OTP memory. Basically, after the OTP is written in step 4, in step 5 the software will re-apply minimim, middle, and maximum inputs and verify that each module output matches the target within the specified error tolerance. 

    3) The Multi-Cal software is written in LabVIEW, and all the low-level control of the TUSB3210 microcontroller is handled by a few .dlls which were developed by a subcontractor from Germany in the early 2000s. Unfortunately, documentation on this is sparse to nonexistent. In general I advise against developing your own software from scratch, but if you do I at least recommend developing in LabVIEW starting from our released source code. This way you can just modify the existing known good software to your own ends, rather than starting completely over.

    Best regards

    Ian Williams

  • Ian,

    Thank you very much. You have been a tremendous resource and very helpful.
    As I said before, I am someone who was brought in on the project to help out a colleague.
    So this has helped our endeavor very much.

    The next steps will be to integrate in the following using the Multi-cal system:

    1. Enable the power supply Script; we have a number of variants that use different power supply voltages.
    2. Enable the pressure Script, I am trying to locate which Fluke device we are using.

    My next question to you would be the nomenclature of :

    Vs = 5.000000E+0
    Vref = 4.096000E+0

    what exactly are those parameters mentioned in the settings from a "out of the box" demonstration perspective?

    4.096V seems like it is an A/D reference and 5V seems like it is the Dut Supply itself, are my assumptions correct? Is this the UUT these parameters are referencing? Or is it something to do with the DAQ board which provides a signal (voltage/reference) chain for the UUT's?

    thank you again Ian for your help.
    Brett Werner
  • Ian,

    1. What does the nomenclature/variables

         Vs = 5.000000E+0
         Vref = 4.096000E+0

          mean exactly? 

    2. I get a pop up box that complains that the path to my pre-cal file is incorrect, yet the path shown in the model, is indeed the path.

    3. The pressure script that comes with the multi-cal evaluation looks like it is a power supply script,

         in fact, it looks like it has the same exact  contents as the power supply script. 

         I thought the pressure script would correlate to a pressure simulator of some kind for sensors and therefore would have commandsk

        associated with one of them.  Have you ever used the pressure script?

  • Hello Brett,

    1. Vs is the supply voltage to the PGA308. Vref is the reference voltage input, which can either be tied directly to Vs or provided by a reference voltage IC or reference voltage output from some other device. Vref = Vs is typically used for ratiometric output applications, while constant Vref is typically used for absolute output applications. Vref impacts the scaling of the coarse offset and fine offset blocks. It can also be selected as a reference for the optional over-underscale circuitry and fault monitor circuits.
    2. It looks like you're still able to proceed with a calibration despite the "wrong path" error, is that correct? In any case, I will investigate this issue.
    3. The pressure script feature is implemented in the main Multi-Cal code, but we haven't tested with any real pressure sources as we don't have any in our labs (typically we use a network of resistor strings and trimpots to emulate pressure sensors). The functionality should work, but creating a script would be up to you and depends on what the pressure source requires. I imagine it would be a very similar type of syntax to the DMM script language.

    Best regards,

    Ian Williams

  • Hello again Brett,

    I've uploaded an updated version of the Multi_CAL_PGA308 software. Please try this version and let me know if you still see the "wrong path" issues.

    The link below will be valid for one week.

    Multi_CAL_PGA308_v2 (Installer).zip

    Best regards,

    Ian Williams

  • Okay Ian,

    Got the updated software from your link

    Thank you for your information and support, you have been very helpful.