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TINA/Spice/LMG5200: LMG5200 bad (non-converging) model.

Part Number: LMG5200
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: TINA-TI,

Tool/software: TINA-TI or Spice Models

It seems, the model for LMG5200 works only for the example circuit with specific load and with specific driving signal timings.

When trying

1)Implement test circuit from the manual(SNOSCY4D–MARCH 2015–REVISED MARCH 2017), page 8 Fig. 5, TINA-TI fails to converge at OP step 2. The computation becomes infinite without any useful result.

2) The original demonstration schematics fail to simulate when the dead time is reduced by the trimming resistor at the AND-gate input. Setting 100Ohm makes simulation unstable. with lower values it will fail

That is not right.

3) Since I got also a non-encrypted model for PSPICE, (* Date: 16SEP2015 Version: Final 3.00), I tried it in LTspice with negative result: The simulation was either very(hours) slow, especially at input pulse edges, or failing with "time step to small". The load current was fundamentally wrong, indicating some short circuit leaking inside the model, with random amplitude shots.

Here is 3 Ohm load under 24V source. The current is totally wrong, if you divide the latter by the former.

I.e., the model can be used for demonstration, but have no practical use.

Dear TI, do you have another, working model for LMG5200?

Unfortunately, we do not have a prototyping machine here to examine the operation in hardware. And the development got very slow at the point of picking predictable high frequency components with models available.

  • I forgot to mention.

    The switching frequency is 10 MHz.

    That is the the reason I need integrated HEMFETs; discrete high-side FETs simply start oscillating on this frequency owing to gate signal trace inductance and other MOS parasitics... Just could not find better combination of FET+driver (but would be happy if there was LMG5x00 with 150-300V rating, because 1-3A would satisfy large inductive load).

  • Hi,

    We will look into this and get back to you shortly.

    Thanks & Regards,
    Arpan Gupta
  • Hi Andrey,

    Could you please provide us your .tsc file for the following setup?

    Thanks & Regards,

    Arpan Gupta

  • Arpan, sorry, it appeared the newest encrypted model for TINA works in TINA under some simplified conditions (not taking into account pcb traces and input logic parasitics)...

    Of course, I prefer LTspice, because of complications and bugs of TINA (TI should not have purchased that ...thing at the first place)

    I have abandoned the idea of using LM5200 and other TI drivers, since these ICs do not incorporate synchronous bootstrap, and simple diode bootstrap resonates with pure-inductive load in H-bridge. When switching frequency goes to 10 MHz, even GaN hemfets are incapable to operate at high side.

    That was a general problem - when it resonates, the high-side source floats like crazy, and no ZVS tank can stabilize it. So the simulation stops as well (or drops dead with errors using unencrypted PSpice model).

    GaN systems have a solution - synchronous bootstrap. But that involves quite a cunning from-the-low-side feedback circuit, which is very hard to implement outside the IC with a few layers. And it should be properly damped with ferrites as well, because of trace inductances.

    And you know, a ZVS tank with an output filter become a stone on your neck, when driving an inductive load...
    So I abandoned the idea until TI implements a synchronous bootstrap crystal from GaN and higher-voltage HEMFETs(at MHz, inductive coils give very strong voltage spikes). Having such device, I would make the thing without ZVS and the filter, using reduced-spectrum +/- pulse-shot modulation.

  • Hi Andrey,

    Thanks for your feedback. I have notified the GaN team about the product ideas.