This thread has been locked.

If you have a related question, please click the "Ask a related question" button in the top right corner. The newly created question will be automatically linked to this question.

LMK05318: Output frequency present even when Reference Inputs are not driven- Need Clarification.

Part Number: LMK05318

Hi,

We are using LMK05318RGZT in our board and it is in testing. 

What we found is we are getting clock frequency at the output even when we don't drive any of the Reference clock Inputs.

We have 48MHZ on board XO that drives the XO input of the LMK05318.

We do not want the output clock present when there is no Reference inputs (Primary/ Secondary) to DPLL.

Please help us to program the IC for this requirement.

I understand that the Hold over & Free run feature is what producing the output frequency even when there is no Reference Inputs.

Can you help us in programming the IC such that output clock should present only when we drive any of the reference input to DPLL.

Appreciate your earliest help in this regard.

Thanks & Regards,

Sathiya Seelan Sekar

  • Hi Sathiya,

    In register R29 (0x1D), bits 1 and 2 are MUTE_DPLL_FRLOCK and MUTE_DPLL_PHLOCK, which will mute the outputs until the DPLL detects frequency lock or phase lock, respectively. These must be used in conjunction with the CHx_MUTE_LVL settings.

    Regards

  • Hi Derek Payne,

    Thank you for the update, but i still need clarity in Register R25 setting.

    We are using channel 0  in HCSL output format & channel 5 in CMOS output using only P in the pair and not using the remaining channels.

    My doubt is, when we set the CHx_MUTE_LVL settings through Register R23, do we need to enable the Mute Control Register R25 for the Output channel 0 & 5 to make the settings effect?

    Please clarify.

    Thanks & Regards,

    Sathiya Seelan Sekar

  • Hi Sathiya,

    Yes, CH0_MUTE and CH5_MUTE must be enabled.

    Regards,

  • Thank you Derek Payne for you earliest response.

    We will test the board & update the feedback.

  • Hi Derek Payne,

    We are yet to implement your suggestion but have few queries that need your clarification.

    I have a doubt in the Free Run and Hold Over feature supported by LMK05318.

    For DPLL mode of operation, It is mentioned in Data Sheet that, after Power On reset,

    "APLL1 locks the VCO1 frequency to the external XO input and operates in free-run mode. Once a
    valid DPLL reference input is detected, the DPLL begins lock acquisition."


    I understand, the PLL1 locks to external XO input first and operate in free-run mode to provide output clocks.

    Next or In parallel, the DPLL lock acquisition begins. It will take some time to lock the PLL1 with (Primary / Secondary) present Reference Input and produce the clock outputs synchronized to these reference input.

    But our requirement is such that, we never want clock at any of the outputs using Free run or Hold over Mode.

    In detail, We want to disable CLK0 and CLK5 output channels to take input from crystal XO when there is no Primary/secondary clocks are present.

    We want CLK0/CLK5 channels to operate only from primary/secondary clocks but not from crystal input.

    we will have either primary/secondary reference clock present in board and we should be getting CLK0 & CLK5 output using that only  and the moment primary/secondary clock is gone or invalid, LMK05318 should not take clock from crystal and feed the CLK0/CLK5 output.

    At present we are getting clock even when there is no primary/secondary clocks.

    Our initialization requirement is like below,

    After the Board Power ON, LMK05318 should drive output clock only when the Primary or Secondary reference clock is present.

    Should not use External XO input to provide output clocks at any point of time.

    When the reference input to DPLL became missing or invalid, then LMK05318 should stop driving all of the output clocks.

    Please let me know if the DPLL PHASE & FREQ Mute configuration settings as suggested by you in our previous thread discussion is sufficient for this requirement OR

    we have option to disable the Free Run & Hold Over Mode to achieve this requirement?

    Please help us at the earliest possible to proceed with our testing.

    Thanks & Regards,

    Sathiya Seelan Sekar

  • Hi Derek Payne,

    We are yet to implement your suggestion but have few queries that need your clarification.

    I have a doubt in the Free Run and Hold Over feature supported by LMK05318.

    For DPLL mode of operation, It is mentioned in Data Sheet that, after Power On reset,

    "APLL1 locks the VCO1 frequency to the external XO input and operates in free-run mode. Once a
    valid DPLL reference input is detected, the DPLL begins lock acquisition."


    I understand, the PLL1 locks to external XO input first and operate in free-run mode to provide output clocks.

    Next or In parallel, the DPLL lock acquisition begins. It will take some time to lock the PLL1 with (Primary / Secondary) present Reference Input and produce the clock outputs synchronized to these reference input.

    But our requirement is such that, we never want clock at any of the outputs using Free run or Hold over Mode.

    In detail, We want to disable CLK0 and CLK5 output channels to take input from crystal XO when there is no Primary/secondary clocks are present.

    We want CLK0/CLK5 channels to operate only from primary/secondary clocks but not from crystal input.

    we will have either primary/secondary reference clock present in board and we should be getting CLK0 & CLK5 output using that only  and the moment primary/secondary clock is gone or invalid, LMK05318 should not take clock from crystal and feed the CLK0/CLK5 output.

    At present we are getting clock even when there is no primary/secondary clocks.

    Our initialization requirement is like below,

    After the Board Power ON, LMK05318 should drive output clock only when the Primary or Secondary reference clock is present.

    Should not use External XO input to provide output clocks at any point of time.

    When the reference input to DPLL became missing or invalid, then LMK05318 should stop driving all of the output clocks.

    Please let me know if the DPLL PHASE & FREQ Mute configuration settings as suggested by you in our previous thread discussion is sufficient for this requirement OR

    we have option to disable the Free Run & Hold Over Mode to achieve this requirement?

    Please help us at the earliest possible to proceed with our testing.

    Thanks & Regards,

    Sathiya Seelan Sekar

  • Hello Sathiya,

    The DPLL phase and frequency mute configuration settings I suggested will mute the output clock whenever the DPLL loses frequency or phase lock. This includes at startup and during normal operation. Whenever PRIREF or SECREF are invalid, the DPLL cannot enter the frequency or phase lock states, and the APLL enters holdover mode or free run mode. DPLL lock state is one of the inputs used to determine if the APLL should enter holdover mode or free run mode, so the outputs will always be muted before entering holdover mode or free run mode (even at startup). And the DPLL will not assert frequency and phase lock until after a valid PRIREF or SECREF signal is available and the DPLL has corrected the VCO frequency to lock to the PRIREF or SECREF signal.

    In other words, the DPLL phase and frequency mute configuration settings ensure that the outputs are always muted when the APLL is in free run or holdover mode.

    For reference, it is possible to disable holdover mode and force free run mode in cases where holdover mode could be used by setting the value of the DPLL_HLDOVR_MODE field (0xFC[2]), but since you know the output will be muted in holdover mode and in free run mode, disabling holdover mode is not necessary to achieve your requirement.

    As for free run mode: TI's DPLL architecture uses the VCO as feedback to the DPLL reference, and the DPLL loop modulates the N-divider of the APLL to increase or decrease the VCO frequency. But the high frequency component of the loop bandwidth is provided by the APLL, and the VCO is ultimately tuned by the APLL charge pump voltage. Disabling free run mode is not possible, because that is functionally equivalent to disabling the APLL. Without the APLL active, and without the XO running to provide a reference input to the phase detector and control the charge pump voltage, the VCO frequency cannot be changed, and the DPLL could never lock. And once the DPLL is locked, the XO frequency error is tuned out by the DPLL adjustments to the APLL N-divider, which are derived from the frequency and phase of PRIREF or SECREF. So as long as you mute the outputs whenever the DPLL phase and frequency are not locked, there will never be a moment where the output frequency accuracy is determined by the XO. 

    Regards,

  • Hi Derek Payne,

    Thank you for the update.

    We have tested the board and now we find that the channel 5 output is not coming out of LMK05318.  (Also did not  measure or check channel1 output status because of limited resources.)

    I have a doubt regarding the DPLL Clock Input Selection.

    What is the recommended settings for the Register R251?

    If i use Auto Revertive input select mode, what is the options i need to select for Manual Sel. mode & Manuaa Sel. Register

    I understood that by avoiding the Manual Fallback or Manual Hold over mode and selecting the auto revertive mode will ensure the APLL1 from entering the Free-run or Holdover mode (As per datasheet Page 31)

    At present we have the below options selected for R251.

    Input select Mode: Auto Revertive.

    Manual Select Mode: DPLL_REF_MAN_REG_SEL

    Manual Sel.Register: Secondary Reference.

    In schematics design, we have option of Hardware REFSEL pin selecting the secondary clock as first priority.

    Is this Hardware select option can be problem when i select Manual Select mode to DPLL_REF_MAN_REG_SEL instead of Hardware Pin: REFSEL?

    Do i need to remove the hardware ref sel resistor option in board or select Manual Select Mode: Hardware Pin: REFSEL?

    Please provide your guidance on selecting the register settings for R251 (DPLL Clock Input Selection).

    Appreciate your earliest response in this regard.

    Thanks & Regards,

    Sathiya Seelan Sekar

  • Hi Sathiya,

    The quickest and easiest way to get started for testing purposes is to set the input select mode to one of the manual modes, either manual fallback if you have multiple references and one can be the fallback, or manual holdover if you only have one reference. Then the manual select mode and the manual sel. register settings will take effect. When in an "auto" input select mode, the settings in manual select mode and manual select register are ignored; instead the R249 settings are used to assign the priorities of the reference inputs, and it sounds like this isn't what you're trying to do.

    Regards,

  • Hi Derek Payne,

    We tested with the register settings you have recommended and we are having issue with the PLL locking itself.

    Below are some of the Status Registers values when we read after programming the board with the settings recommended.

    R13 – 0x000D0D   (LOL PLL1, PLL2, XO registers) - PLL1, PLL2, XO lock seems lost

    R100 – 0x006404  (Looks like PLL2 is enabled).Is it necessary to use PLL2 for the CH_5 Output as recommended in TICS pro tool? 

    R411 – 0x019B0B (Seems Secondary reference which we are feeding is in valid state)

    Also attaching the configuration register settings Hex Register values we have used to program the LMK05318 herewith for your reference.

    Kindly let us know how to proceed with our testing. Suggest any register settings changes necessary.

    Thanks & Regards,

    Sathiya Seelan Sekar.

    Clk_Buffer_Manual_Mode_Reset_CH5_Issue.txt
    R0	0x000010
    R1	0x00010B
    R2	0x000235
    R3	0x000300
    R4	0x000400
    R5	0x000500
    R6	0x000600
    R7	0x000700
    R8	0x000802
    R10	0x000AC8
    R11	0x000B00
    R12	0x000C3B
    R13	0x000D08
    R14	0x000E00
    R15	0x000F00
    R16	0x001000
    R17	0x00111D
    R18	0x0012FF
    R19	0x001300
    R20	0x001400
    R21	0x001500
    R22	0x001600
    R23	0x001755
    R24	0x00185D
    R25	0x0019FF
    R26	0x001A00
    R27	0x001B00
    R28	0x001C01
    R29	0x001D17
    R30	0x001E40
    R32	0x002044
    R35	0x002300
    R36	0x002403
    R37	0x002500
    R38	0x002600
    R39	0x002702
    R40	0x002800
    R41	0x002900
    R42	0x002A01
    R43	0x002BC2
    R44	0x002C01
    R45	0x002D00
    R46	0x002E44
    R47	0x002F07
    R48	0x003050
    R49	0x00314A
    R50	0x003236
    R51	0x00332C
    R52	0x003400
    R53	0x003518
    R54	0x003600
    R55	0x003700
    R56	0x003800
    R57	0x003900
    R58	0x003A00
    R59	0x003B3C
    R60	0x003C18
    R61	0x003D00
    R62	0x003E00
    R63	0x003F00
    R64	0x004000
    R65	0x004100
    R66	0x004200
    R67	0x004300
    R68	0x004408
    R69	0x004500
    R70	0x004600
    R71	0x004700
    R72	0x00483F
    R73	0x004900
    R74	0x004A00
    R75	0x004B00
    R76	0x004C00
    R77	0x004D0F
    R78	0x004E00
    R79	0x004F00
    R80	0x005080
    R81	0x00510A
    R82	0x005200
    R83	0x00530E
    R84	0x005410
    R85	0x00555D
    R86	0x005600
    R87	0x00571E
    R88	0x005884
    R89	0x005982
    R90	0x005A00
    R91	0x005B14
    R92	0x005C00
    R93	0x005D0E
    R94	0x005E10
    R95	0x005F5D
    R96	0x006000
    R97	0x00611E
    R98	0x006284
    R99	0x006382
    R100	0x006429
    R101	0x006502
    R102	0x006622
    R103	0x00670F
    R104	0x006818
    R105	0x006905
    R106	0x006A00
    R107	0x006B64
    R108	0x006C00
    R109	0x006D68
    R110	0x006E28
    R111	0x006F00
    R112	0x007011
    R113	0x007179
    R114	0x00727A
    R115	0x007303
    R116	0x007401
    R117	0x007500
    R118	0x007600
    R119	0x007700
    R120	0x007800
    R121	0x007900
    R122	0x007A00
    R123	0x007B28
    R124	0x007C09
    R125	0x007DE5
    R126	0x007E35
    R127	0x007F2E
    R128	0x008000
    R129	0x008105
    R130	0x008200
    R131	0x008301
    R132	0x008401
    R133	0x008577
    R134	0x008600
    R135	0x008728
    R136	0x00884F
    R137	0x00898F
    R138	0x008A8A
    R139	0x008B03
    R140	0x008C02
    R141	0x008D00
    R142	0x008E01
    R143	0x008F01
    R144	0x009077
    R145	0x009101
    R146	0x009281
    R147	0x009320
    R149	0x00950D
    R150	0x009600
    R151	0x009701
    R152	0x00980D
    R153	0x009929
    R154	0x009A24
    R155	0x009B8B
    R156	0x009C01
    R157	0x009D00
    R158	0x009E00
    R159	0x009F00
    R160	0x00A0FC
    R161	0x00A100
    R162	0x00A200
    R164	0x00A400
    R165	0x00A500
    R167	0x00A701
    R178	0x00B200
    R180	0x00B400
    R181	0x00B500
    R182	0x00B600
    R183	0x00B700
    R184	0x00B800
    R185	0x00B904
    R186	0x00BA01
    R187	0x00BB00
    R188	0x00BC00
    R189	0x00BD00
    R190	0x00BE01
    R191	0x00BF00
    R192	0x00C050
    R193	0x00C12B
    R194	0x00C22B
    R195	0x00C300
    R196	0x00C400
    R197	0x00C509
    R198	0x00C600
    R199	0x00C700
    R200	0x00C809
    R201	0x00C900
    R202	0x00CA00
    R203	0x00CB00
    R204	0x00CC03
    R205	0x00CD00
    R206	0x00CE00
    R207	0x00CF03
    R208	0x00D000
    R209	0x00D108
    R210	0x00D200
    R211	0x00D30A
    R212	0x00D400
    R213	0x00D508
    R214	0x00D600
    R215	0x00D70A
    R216	0x00D800
    R217	0x00D900
    R218	0x00DA03
    R219	0x00DB2D
    R220	0x00DCB9
    R221	0x00DD00
    R222	0x00DE06
    R223	0x00DF1A
    R224	0x00E081
    R225	0x00E100
    R226	0x00E203
    R227	0x00E32D
    R228	0x00E4B9
    R229	0x00E500
    R230	0x00E606
    R231	0x00E71A
    R232	0x00E881
    R233	0x00E90A
    R234	0x00EA0A
    R235	0x00EB00
    R236	0x00EC00
    R237	0x00ED00
    R238	0x00EE00
    R239	0x00EF00
    R240	0x00F000
    R241	0x00F100
    R242	0x00F200
    R243	0x00F300
    R244	0x00F400
    R249	0x00F912
    R250	0x00FA00
    R251	0x00FB32
    R252	0x00FC2D
    R253	0x00FD00
    R254	0x00FE00
    R255	0x00FF00
    R256	0x010000
    R257	0x010101
    R258	0x010200
    R259	0x010301
    R260	0x010402
    R261	0x010580
    R262	0x010600
    R263	0x010700
    R264	0x010800
    R265	0x010900
    R266	0x010AC8
    R267	0x010BA0
    R268	0x010C0C
    R269	0x010D0A
    R270	0x010E02
    R271	0x010F14
    R272	0x011000
    R273	0x011100
    R274	0x011200
    R275	0x01130E
    R276	0x01140C
    R277	0x01150E
    R278	0x011609
    R279	0x011708
    R280	0x011809
    R281	0x011907
    R282	0x011A0D
    R283	0x011B07
    R284	0x011C1E
    R285	0x011D1E
    R286	0x011E02
    R287	0x011F30
    R288	0x012000
    R289	0x0121EE
    R290	0x012202
    R291	0x0123CA
    R292	0x012409
    R293	0x012501
    R294	0x012600
    R295	0x01272C
    R296	0x012808
    R297	0x01290C
    R298	0x012A08
    R299	0x012B01
    R300	0x012C00
    R301	0x012D1C
    R302	0x012E20
    R303	0x012F00
    R304	0x013001
    R305	0x013100
    R306	0x013200
    R307	0x013300
    R308	0x013410
    R309	0x0135AA
    R310	0x0136AA
    R311	0x0137AA
    R312	0x0138AA
    R313	0x0139AA
    R314	0x013AFF
    R315	0x013BFF
    R316	0x013CFF
    R317	0x013DFF
    R318	0x013EFF
    R319	0x013F03
    R320	0x014000
    R321	0x01410A
    R322	0x014200
    R323	0x014324
    R324	0x01449F
    R325	0x014500
    R326	0x014600
    R327	0x014798
    R328	0x014896
    R329	0x014980
    R330	0x014A00
    R331	0x014B64
    R332	0x014C00
    R333	0x014D24
    R334	0x014E9F
    R335	0x014F00
    R336	0x015000
    R337	0x015198
    R338	0x015296
    R339	0x015380
    R340	0x015400
    R341	0x015500
    R342	0x015600
    R343	0x015700
    R344	0x015800
    R345	0x015900
    R346	0x015A00
    R347	0x015B00
    R348	0x015C00
    R349	0x015D00
    R350	0x015E00
    R351	0x015FB7
    R352	0x016000
    R357	0x016528
    R367	0x016F00
    R411	0x019B04
    

  • Hi Sathiya,

    Apologies for the delay. The attached text file with the register settings do not match the readback values given above. Can you also provide the .tcs file? The TCS file includes the frequency plan in addition to just the register settings.

    Is the 48MHz XO powered and driving the XO_P or XO_N pin(s)? Do you have a schematic snippet you can share showing this portion? I see in the attached text settings that the XO interface type is set to CMOS, so perhaps you are trying to AC-couple the XO, or you are overdriving the signal? The allowable range of LMK05318 XO pin single-ended signals is between 1Vpp and 2.6Vpp, so 3.3V CMOS signals must be divided down with an external resistor divider as shown below:

    You will need the XO to be recognized in the system before any further progress can be made. One way to check the internal copy of the XO signal is to use one of the status pins to output PLL1 reference divider signal using the STAT0_SEL or STAT1_SEL controls. The output should always be a clean frequency - if you do not see a clean frequency, this implies the XO signal may be too low power, or may not be coupled properly to the XO input.

    I don't have your full frequency plan. If the output frequencies you need are all integer divides of 2500MHz, PLL2 can be disabled. Additionally, you'll want to clear R29[4] MUTE_APLL2_LOCK, since APLL2 is not used.

    If the settings in the text file you attached can be trusted, I believe that the SECREF is validating. The early and missing clock detectors, the non-CMOS amplitude detector, and the validation timer are all independent of the XO circuit.

    Regards,