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TPS24750: Discrepancy between Data Sheet and Design Tool with regard to dv/dt Control in Inrush Mode (Calculation of Cgate)

Part Number: TPS24750

According to data sheet, the gate capacitor Cgate is calculated by equation 15. An intrinsic capacitor Cintrs is deducted from the first term. In the text above, the value of Cintrs is stated to be about 175pF.

In the design tool (TPS2475x_Design_Calculator_LowVin_Rev-.xls), Cgate is calculated in line 71. There, this Cintrs is a totally different value, calculated from (22nC / 5.8V), values taken from lines 24 and 26, respectively. That equals to 3.8nF. As a consequence, my intended slew rate of 10V/ms (leading to 0.5A loading the output capacitor of 50µF) even leads to a negative Cgate.

Since a reasonable result is achieved by the example of using 4.7nF as Cgate in the data sheet (measurement in figure 44), I think that the design tool is wrong.

Could you please advise as a quick fix if I just can use the 175pF for the second term in line 71 of the design tool, or is there a more global error with the gate charge of 22nF (line 24)?

One note to the accuracy of the dV/dt control. Looking at the measurement of the example in the data sheet (figure 44) it seems that the actual output slew rate is about twice as high as expected (expectation would be 7V/ms according to equation 15 and assuming 175pF is correct). Does it make sense to correct the calculated Cgate by this empiric factor of 2 (means use twice the calculated value), or is there just a large variation of FET parameters in the production of the device?

  • Hi Chris,

    I think equation-15 in the datasheet is wrong. It is hard to believe 175 pF parasitic capacitance for a 3mOhm internal FET. Let me check.
    Can you please share your design sheet.

    Best Regards,
    Rakesh
  • TPS2475x Low Vin Design Tool

    Fixed Values

    User Entries

    Calculated

    Device Parameters

    Parameter

    Description

    Value 

     Units

    FBMAX

    Maximum Recommended Foldback

    12,0

    VSNSMIN

    Mimum recommended sense voltage 

    3,0

    mV

    T_margin

    Timer Margin (Accounts for tolerance of QFET, I_timer, I_source, P_LIM, C_timer)

    50,0

    %

    Rdson_max

    Maximum FET Rdson (@125C)

    5,0

    m-ohm

    TJFETMAX

    Maximum FET junction temperature

    150,0

    ˚C

    DRETRY

    Retry duty cycle

    4,0

    %

    Minimum Recommended SOA margin

    25,0

    %

    Vtimer

    Timer threshold

    1,35

    V

    Itimer

    Timer charge current

    10,0E-6

    A

    ENR

    Rising enable  threshold

    1,35

    V

    ENF

    Falling enable threshold

    1,30

    V

    OVR

    Rising OV threshold

    1,35

    V

    OVF

    Falling OV threshold

    1,29

    V

    I_source

    Gate Sourcing Current

    3,00E-05

    A

    QFET

    Internal FET Gate charge to reach to 5.8V

    22,0E-9

    C

    VFST

    Minimum Fast Trip Threshold

    52,0E-3

    V

    Vta

    Timer de-activation voltage

    5,80

    V

    Key User Inputs

    Parameter

    Description

    Value 

     Units

    ILIM

    Current Limit (Recommended >10% over max load)

    3,0

    A

    VBUS_MAX

    maximum input bus voltage

    3,5

    V

    CLOAD

    Output load capacitance

    50,0

    uF

    RLOAD-start

    Resistive load present at start up (not recommended)

    50,0

    Ohm

    TAMB

    Maximum Ambient Temperature

    60,0

    ˚C

    RJA

    Junction to ambient thermal resistance 

    40,0

    ˚C/W

    QB_FET

    Gate charge (Vg = 5.8V) of blocking FET. Enter 0 if no blocking FET is used. 

    0,00E+0

    C

    Rsns_max

    Maximum Sense Resistor

    17,3

    m-ohm

    Rsense

    Sense Resistor 

    5,0

    m-ohm

    PLIM,MIN

    Minimum recommended Power Limit

    2,1

    W

    Plim-typ

    Programmed power limit

    6,0

    W

    Retry? 

    Is this configured in retry mode? (Yes or No)

    Yes

    dV/dt?

    Gate slew rate control? (Yes or No)

    Yes

    Iramp

    Choose output capacitor charge current (<Plim/Vccmax)

    0,4

    A

    Basic Circuit Design Results

    Parameter

    Description

    Value 

     Units

    Tcap

    Time to charge output cap under Power Limiting

    0,080

    ms

    T_FET

    Time to charge Vgs to Vt, and Vt to 5.8V once Vout is up

    0,733

    ms

    T-dvdt

    Time for Vgate = Vbus+5.8, when using dv/dt start-up with C-gate

    0,000

    ms

    T_total

    Typical Start Time

    0,733

    ms

    T_fault

    Needed Fault time for margin to start-up time

    1,100

    ms

    PDCFET

    Maximum steady state FET power dissipation

    0,24

    W

    TJDCMAX

    Maximum Steady State Junction temperature

    69,6

    ˚C

    SOA_25C

    Power FET can handle for T_fault @ 25C

    51,948

    W

    SOA_der

    derate above for the eleveated junction temperature

    33,413

    W

    SOA_mrg

    SOA margin

    82,0

    %

    Power Limit Pass

    YES

    SOA Pass

    YES

    Compute Required Circuit Values

    Parameter

    Description

    Value 

     Units

    Rset

    Choose Rset value

    51,1

    Ohm

    Rimon1

    Calculate Rimon value for current limit

    2299,500

    Ohm

    Rimon

    Choose closest 1% resistor

    2700,000

    Ohm

    Ilimit_act

    Actual I-limit value

    2,555

    A

    Rprog1

    Calculated Rprog value for Plim-typ

    53229

    Ohm

    Rprog

    Choose closest 1% resistor

    62000

    Ohm

    Plimit_act

    Actual power limit for Rprog

    5,151

    W

    Cgatec

    Calculated gate capacitor to obtain inrush current = Iramp

    -43,1E-12

    F

    Cgate

    Gate capacitor used for dV/dt Control

    0,00E+0

    F

    Iramp_act

    Actual Inrush (Ramp) Current for dV/dt Control

    0,395

    A

    Ctimer1

    Calculate fault timer capacitor value

    8,15E-9

    F

    Ctimer

    Choose Ctimer >= Ctimer1

    100E-9

    F

    Tfault_act

    Actual fault Time

    13,5

    ms

    ENRise

    Circuit turn on voltage with rising Vin

    2,5

    V

    OVRise

    Circuit turn off under over voltage event

    4,0

    V

    R2

    Target middle resistor

    10000,0

    Ohm

    R3_c

    Calculated bottom resistor

    16666,7

    Ohm

    R3

    Choose R3

    22000,0

    Ohm

    R1_c

    Calculated top resistor

    33185,2

    Ohm

    R1

    Choose R1

    33000,0

    Ohm

    UVLO-R

    Actual turn on with rising input voltage (low voltage)

    2,742

    V

    UVLO-F

    Actual turn off with falling input voltage (low voltage)

    2,641

    V

    OVLO-R

    Actual turn off with rising input voltage (overvoltage)

    3,989

    V

    OVLO-F

    Actual turn on with falling input voltage (overvoltage)

    3,811

    V

    IMONsf

    Current monitor scale factor (I = Vimon x IMONsf)

    3,785

    A/V

    I noticed that I was mistaken wrt. figure 44 of the datasheet. The time scale is 5ms/div, therefore the slew rate in this figure is about 4V/ms, which is less than calculated with equation 15. If the 3.8nF (22nC/5.8V) is a more realistic value for Cgate, then this would explain the discrepancy, and the datasheet would be wrong.

    As for my use case, if I want to have a slew rate between 5V/ms and 10V/ms: would that mean that I do not have to connect a capacitor to the Gate pin, since the device is not faster in any case?

  • Hi Chris,

    Equation-15 needs correction. Please consider 3.8nF for CINTRS and use equation-15.
    For 10V/ms, you will not need external cap CGATE.

    Best Regards,
    Rakesh