TRF372017: VBB input voltage range

Kai Nomiyama

Part Number: TRF372017
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: TRF370317

Hi Team,

TRF372017 datasheet doesn't describe base-band input voltage range(VBB).
I checked following e2e and it said VBB range is 1Vpeak-to-peak.
https://e2e.ti.com/support/rf-microwave-group/rf-microwave/f/rf-microwave-forum/821476/trf372017-what-s-the-baseband-input-range?tisearch=e2e-sitesearch&keymatch=TRF372017%252520AND%252520range#

However, TRF372017 figure 56 shows VBB SE RMS is 100 to 1000mV so TRF372017 might support 1V*2√2 = 2.83Vpeak-to-peak.
Also TRF370317 figure 1 shows VBB SE RMS is 25 to 800mV.

therefore, TRF372017 should support much higher VBB range than 1Vpeak-to-peak so could you let me know what is the VBB input range?
If there are anything concern or trade off when the VBB is higher than 1Vpeak-to-peak, could you let me know?

Regards,
Kai

over 2 years ago

0 Kang Hsia over 2 years ago

TI__Guru 65954 points

Hello Nomiyama-san

The P1dB range specify the input range before the output reaches the P1dB point (i.e. close to saturation). You may use the information of Gain (G) and P1dB to calculate the maximum input Vbb range.

Please see below for the spec for P1dB as an example

0 Kai Nomiyama over 2 years ago in reply to Kang Hsia

TI__Expert 5285 points

Hi Kang,

Could you let me know how to calculate the maximum input Vbb range from Gain and P1dB since I couldn't find that equation in datasheet?

Regards,

Kai

0 Kang Hsia over 2 years ago in reply to Kai Nomiyama

TI__Guru 65954 points

Hello Nomiyama-san,

P1dB is the output compression point output power. You can get the P1dB-Input by doing the following:

P1dB-Input = P1dB(output) - G

This will give you the equivalent P1dB power referred to the input. You may then convert this to standard RMS voltage.

-Kang

0 Kai Nomiyama over 2 years ago in reply to Kang Hsia

TI__Expert 5285 points

Hi Kang,

I make attached calculation tool.
Please correct it if there is something wrong but I think we need load to calculate input Voltage range.
Is my understanding correct?

TRF372017_input_voltage_range.xlsx

Above limitation is coming from P1dB but we might also have some device spec limitation of input voltage range.
Is it VCC5V,VCC_VCO2 or VCC3V?

Regards,
Kai

0 Kang Hsia over 2 years ago in reply to Kai Nomiyama

TI__Guru 65954 points

Hi Nomiyama-san

I found one error:

I use the following tutorial site to calculate Vrms and Vpp

http://referencedesigner.com/rfcal/cal_02.php

You may refer to the following app note. It talks about baseband input terminations. Typically, both source and load termination will create equivalent of 50ohm differential

https://www.ti.com/lit/ug/slua647a/slua647a.pdf?ts=1634735108880&ref_url=https%253A%252F%252Fwww.ti.com%252Fproduct%252FDAC3484

Vpp is being calculated as above

P1dB is a very typical amplifier characteristics. The effect of P1dB is not limited to power supplies, but also silicon/transisitor bias/saturation.

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TRF372017: VBB input voltage range