CC2642R-Q1: RADAR Time of Flight (TOF) - Variance of TICK

Hello Donatz,

I have assigned an expert to comment.

Hi,

1. Sigma was found using data coming from devices coming from a single production batch.

2. I do not have data to answer. Sigma might vary between the devices but its average value should be constant if you consider the whole TI's production.

3. No. Sigma's value is due to some nano-differences during the doping process.

4. No.

Regards,

Hi Clément,

As always, thank you for your response...

2. If you don't have the data...

    Is it possible, if you could introduce me to someone who knows?

    Or would it be best for me, to directly consult an FAE (Field Application Engineer) for this matter ?

4. If I would try to calculate the min-max range, 

would TI E2E team be able to share some vital information such as semiconductor process technology used,

jitter simulation results (in different process corners, temperature, voltage) and the like? 

  Do I need to do an NDA (non-disclosure agreement) for this?

Best Regards,

Hi Donatz,

As a supplier of Bluetooth® Low Energy (BLE) solutions we are committed to making available high quality software stacks with a focus on interoperability and broad market adoption.

In previous Software Development Kits (SDKs), TI introduced, on an experimental basis, a new innovative ranging technology called Time-of-Flight (ToF) together with our BLE Software Stack as a software example to demonstrate one possible option for new ranging technologies. This ToF example technology was based on a proprietary extension demonstrating operation between compatible TI devices only.

In this increasingly connected world, interoperability between different suppliers and systems is a critical value and TI listens to this market and customer requirement. Moving forward, TI has decided to merge our secure ranging efforts onto a standardized solution with focus on broad adaption and interoperability.

As part of this decision to focus on standardized solutions, TI has made the decision to discontinue further development and support of the TI-proprietary ToF and TI-proprietary Angle-of-Arrival (AoA) software examples in the SDKs listed below:

• Proprietary ToF in the SimpleLink CC13x2 and CC26x2 SDK(*)
• Proprietary ToF in the SimpleLink CC2640R2 SDK
• Proprietary AoA in the SimpleLink CC2640R2 SDK                             

(*) Angle-of-Arrival software examples based on the Bluetooth 5.1 specification are not affected by this change.

We recommend to transition from proprietary Real Time Locating System (RTLS) software examples to the new RTLS software examples based on the Bluetooth 5.1 specification. These examples are included in the SimpleLink™ CC13x2 and CC26x2 software development kit 3.40 or later.

At the same time, we are placing an emphasis on creating a standard for secured ranging technologies and intend to convert the existing technology when these solutions become available.

Hi Evan,

Good day.

Thank you very much for keeping me posted about TI BLE.

However, this still does not resolve my issue with the variance of TI ToF Tick.

By the way, If I may, I would like to ask... I am hoping that, maybe you could answer...

Let's say I will use TI's ToF technology (for localization functionality) in a product.

In mass production stage of the above mentioned product, can I purchase TI devices with "sigma = 0.50 ~ 0.70" range only?

Can TI devices be sorted out (in TI's semiconductor manufacturing line) depending on tick sigma values?

Best Regards,

Hi Donatz,

As I said before, TI has made the decision to discontinue further development and support of the TI-proprietary ToF. We do not recommend it for production at this point in time. Are you intending to take this into production or just evaluating the technology of time of flight as a whole to understand what new ranging technologies may look like?

Hi Evan,

Thank you very much for your response and recommendation.

To answer your question above...

My final goal or main intention is take your ToF technology into production.

But, of course, in any business perspective, it is imperative to understand and evaluate the technology (scientifically), before doing so.

This includes investigating your good company's manufacturing process capability.

As for my question, this is not a rhetorical one...

It would be very much appreciated, if you could answer it with a simple YES or NO.

※in case this question of mine is bounded by the "discontinue further development and support of the TI-proprietary ToF", please just tell that it is...

Best Regards,

Part Number: CC2642R-Q1

Hi E2E Team,

Good Day.

Regarding the TI ToF Discontinuance Announcement as mentioned in the forums below:

CC2642R-Q1: RADAR Time of Flight (TOF) - Variance of TICK
CC2642R-Q1: RADAR Time of Flight (TOF) - Measurement Packets Contents

The below image reflects my understanding on this matter. (If I understand it incorrectly, it would be appreciated let me know)

I understand that, further development on both hardware and software would cease to continue.
However, what I need to clarify is the coverage or extent of the discontinuance of the support.
If possible, please answer the all questions below with a YES or a NO.

CHIPSET USAGE
①Can customers still use or execute previously deployed SDK ToF samples to the TI chip, from now onward)?

HARDWARE TECHNICAL SUPPORT
②Will TI still share previously known scientific principles and manufacturing information to customer such as
   the possibility of sorting IC's according to Tick variance (sigma=0.50 ~ 0.60) range, etc.

SOFTWARE TECHNICAL SUPPORT
③Will TI stop answering inquiries about previously deployed SDKs?

Hoping for TI's enlightenment.

Best Regards,

Hey Donatz,

Apologies for the delay. Much of TI has been on holiday for the last few days. 

TI's previous releases of Time of Flight have only previously been for Evaluation Only as active development and research was on going as we worked towards a final solution. As it stands today, we no longer have a path forward for any production variant of proprietary Time of Flight. We are taking the lessons we have learned with ToF and are placing an emphasis on creating a standard for secured ranging technologies intend to convert these lessons into such technology.

To your question about tick variance, that diagram was primarily built as an example to demonstrate the variance that could exist in any measurement. It was not a fundamental statement of the variance that every measurement will see. There are further factors that could lead to a wider distribution as well such as a device that was/is moving while a ToF run was running.

I have been looped in an email chain with some of your colleagues as well and we can have a further discussion offline on any open questions. 

Hi Evan,

Good day.

It would be greatly appreciated, if you could answer my inquiries in the thread below:

https://e2e.ti.com/support/wireless-connectivity/bluetooth/f/538/p/889760/3314676#3314676

As for possible offline discussion that you have mentioned above,

how can I reach you offline?

Best Regards

Hi,

The best way to engage an off-line discussion is to contact your local sales teams.

Thanks and regards,

Hi,

The best way to engage an off-line discussion is to contact your local sales teams.

Thanks and regards,

Hi Clément,

Thank you for your response.

If you, or someone could answer my inquiries (with a simple YES or NO) in the below link:

https://e2e.ti.com/support/wireless-connectivity/bluetooth/f/538/p/889760/3314676#3314676

An off-line discussion would no longer be necessary.

Best Regards,

Hi,

Donatz said:

CHIPSET USAGE
①Can customers still use or execute previously deployed SDK ToF samples to the TI chip, from now onward)?

HARDWARE TECHNICAL SUPPORT
②Will TI still share previously known scientific principles and manufacturing information to customer such as
   the possibility of sorting IC's according to Tick variance (sigma=0.50 ~ 0.60) range, etc.

SOFTWARE TECHNICAL SUPPORT
③Will TI stop answering inquiries about previously deployed SDKs?

1- Yes. (But the content of the SDK would be as RTMed - without new features or bugfix)

2- Yes and no. The document already online will remain online (I can't say  for ever, but for there is absolutely no plan for the moment to remove them). However, no new publication of document or collateral will happen.

3- This answer cannot be answered by a simple "yes" or "no" (neither by a "yes and no" ^^). This completely depends on the support required and need to be discuss with TI's sales teams.

Kind regards,

Hi Clément,

I truly appreciated your direct response.

1. It is understood.

2. Being more specific,

I would like to know if TI TICK sigma can be sorted in TI Manufacturing plant.

Let us say, I would just like to purchase those IC's that are within the sigma= 0.50 ~ 0.70 only.

Will TI still be considering such purchase requests, even though TI ToF development is discontinued?

※Please answer with a YES or NO -- similar manner on how you enlightened questions 1 & 3.

3. It is understood. I will contact TI Sale's Team for this matter.

Best Regards,

Hi,

2- I have never heard about such a possibility (at the same time I am not working in sales...). This can definitely be a question for the sales team :)

Best regards,

Hi Clément,

Thank you very much for the enlightenment.

I would be contacting TI Sales Team about this matter as well.

Best Regards,