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BQ24450 or UC3906 Max Allowed voltage

Other Parts Discussed in Thread: BQ24450, UC3906, BQ24650

 

Hi there, 

My setup is 

Battery Configuration is  24V 1.5Ah lead Acid Valve Regulated Battery

I am  planning to use BQ24450 or UC3096 in my battery charger.

I am bit confused regarding the Max voltage allowed to use with this IC.

 

Want to charge 24 V battery using this IC BQ24450 or UC 3096,  and also want to protect battery from deep discharge..

Can i use one of these IC to charge 24 V battery ?

Secondly are u still selling UC 3096 ?

which one is better UC 3096 or BQ24450 ?

 

Thanks for your help,

ASAP

bye 

Danny

 

  • Yes, either IC can charge a 24V battery.  The maximum rating on the IN pin is 40V.  OUT must be lower than IN for the linear charger to work properly.

    Either the UC3906 or BQ24450 are available and orderable.  For new designs, I would recommend the bq24450.

  • these days i'm working on BQ24650 . It's adjustable . I prefer you to use it.

  • thanks for the help

    :)

  • Hi there, 

    Unfortunately Bq24450 is not available so i am going for old UC3096

    I was reading the design notes and found a circuit for deep discharge protection on page 3-84.

    My aim is to design a charger which could charge the battery in fast mode, trickle mode, float mode and also have deep and over charging protection..

    http://focus.ti.com/lit/an/slua115/slua115.pdf

    I have few questions, which are stated below.

    I am bit confused how to determine values for R1 R2 R3 R4 R5 R6 R7 R8

    secondly, transistor Q1 ( iam going for NPN  Transistor 3A T092  63 V), is this fine ?

    thridly, if u could help me, how to find value for C2 capacitor.

    Forth, is this circuit sufficient enough for over and deep discharge protection ? or do i need to put in extra circuity ?

    Any help will be appreciated.

    Best Regards,

    Danish

  • First, let me complete the circuit in figure 9 which has been truncated on the left of the screen: add a diode from Charger’s Primary Power Source to D1’s cathode and connect that point (D1 cathode/Supply Input) to pin 5 of the IC.  Add a capacitor from that point to ground labeled C1.

    R5-R8 are sized in the usual way to provide the proper pre-charge, boost charge, full-charge. and battery cutoff points.

    R3 and R4 are sized to provide enough base drive to Q1 when powered from either the pre-chg pin or the primary power source.

    R1 and R2 and sized to limit the current through Q1 and the relay.

    I cannot determine if a given transistor is ok for a given application.  You can calculate the power being dissipated in it in your system under your conditions and then calculate the amount of temperature rise based on how you will mount it and the airflow and ambient temperature etc.

    C2 is sized as explained in the app note.  It is there to supply the load for as long as it takes for Q1 to turn off and the relay to close, as the input power is removed.

    This circuit will disconnect the battery from the load if the battery voltage gets too low.  This simply sets a voltage level at which the cell will not be allowed to discharge past.

  • wow 

    really wanted some guidelines and u provided me :)

    cheers a lot

    this will be very helpful for me...

    I will let you know when I am done ...

     

    thanks for the help

    Regards

    Danish :)

  • Hi there, 

    new day new problems.......

    Vref is the new confusion .. how to determine this value

    by reading the manual again and again 

    i think Vref and temperature co efficent are same ?

    plz explain it......... 

    secondly there is alot of misprinting i think.... formulas at page 3-81 

    V12=95 Voc i think it should be 0.95 Voc

    V31=9Vf it should be 0.9 Vf

    Imax=25V/Rs ??? what is V

    Ioct=025V/Rs ??

    please confirm these formulas........

    Regards

    Danish

     

  • Vref is specified in the datasheet and is the internal, temperature varying reference voltage of 2.3V at 25C.

    Yes, there are decimal points missing in the formulas but you were keen enough to catch that.  Yes, 95 should be 0.95, 9 should be 0.9, 25V should be 0.25V, and 025 should be .025.  The 'V' is the units of Volts to make the units work out in the formulas.

    Note that these formulas in the app note directly correspond to those in the bq24450 datasheet.

  • Thanks for the help Chris.... without u i could nt have come this far :)

    My Setup is now..

    Want to charge Two 12v 1.2Ah batteries 

     

    Thanks to Chris for pointing that out.

    My design parameters: 

    Final discharge voltage (1.75v/cell) = 21v ( dont know how to use it on my circuit i think it will be V31=24.624v )

    Float voltage (2.28v/cell) = 27.36v  

    Over Charge Voltage (2.425v/cell) = 29.1v 

    V12=27.64v

    V31=24.624v

    Imax= 0.1cA= 120mA

    Ioct= 12mA

    Rs=2.08 ohms 

    According to formulas....

    Rc= 46K ohms ( 2.3v/50uA)

    Ra+Rb=11.89 - eq1

    535.9kRb= 46kRa +RaRb -eq2

    solving both equation 

    Ra= 3.210k      Rb= 34.96k

    These values were determine through design notes of UC3096.

    Chris am I going in the right direction ????

    if yes ... then i will make my circuit ......

    Thanks for all your help and support

    Danish

     

     

     

  • V31 is the pack voltage at which charge will be started again after having previously finished (gone through all 3 phases). It is simply a voltage at pin 13 equal to 90% of the 2.3V reference. 

    The 4 resistor around the IC (R5-R8) can be sized exactly the same way as in the bq24450 datasheet example design.  The VTH is the final discharge voltage that the relay will trip at.  Instead of trickle charging the pack, it will open the relay to disconnect the pack from the load.

    I don't think you can use any of the equations in the app note, as none are applicable to the relay load disconnect circuit which uses 4 resistors not 2 or 3.  Instead, use the equations in the bq24450 datasheet design example.  Using those, I get: Rc = 46k, Rd = 662.5k, Rb = 16.6k, Ra = 484.6k.  But check my math.

  • Welll Chris.... Thanks alot for all the help and support... You have been brilliant through out :)

    You are a genius ........... Texas Instrument is so good I could believe that.... 
    In next project i will everything is from TI :D

    Your math is brilliant

    Ra= 484.42Kohms

    Rb= 16.58Kohms

    Rc=46Kohms

    Rd=659.33Kohms.

    little bit variation compare to urs.... ( may be i did round off at some point ) ..

    So far so good I will have go on the circuit ... let see wht happens 

    Thanks again for all the support and help

    Really I appreciate that...

    Bye 

  • Hi Chris, 

    How are u ?

    Well just a quick question, is there any pass element on page 3-84 Application design note of UC3906. 

    if needed can i have a NPN pass element ?

     

    Thanks for ur Help 


    Good bye 

    And have a nice weekend

     

  • Yes, you can use an NPN pass element.  The bq24450 datasheet provides a good explanation of different pass element topologies with some tradeoffs for each.

  • Hi Chris, 

    Thanks for the reply... but i am specifically asking abt the deep discharge protection circuit on page 3-84 fig 9 of UC 3906 application note. I am confused shall i use a pass element or not...

    Any help will be appreciated.

  • Yes, you have to use a pass element (transistor).  The UC3906 controls the charging by controlling this pass element.

    Figure 9 is a simplified version of a basic UC3906 schematic.  They didn't draw all of the parts needed as that would make figure 9 too complicated.  So, they are simply building on other circuits introduced earlier in the app note and just showing what is new.