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ADS1241 Crystal driver specification

Other Parts Discussed in Thread: ADS1241

Hi,

What is the specifications that customer can use when selecting crystal to ADS1241?

Is an ESR of 150R working?

Is there a specification of the oscillator driver?

Thanks

Helge

  • Helge,


    I'm not aware of any specifications on the driver for the crystal oscillator. We have made recommendations for specific crystals in the datasheet as shown in Table 2 on page 12 of the datasheet (three ECS and one CTS crystal). I know that the device was tested with these crystals.

    In the past, there was an EVM for this device which used the HC49 crystal made by CTS, which I believe is the same as listed in the datasheet (with the vendor number listed as MP042S).


    Joseph Wu
  • Hi Joseph,

    The customer gets boards returned from the field where the oscillator does not work even though it worked when tested in production.
    It can be started again if they apply some solder to the terminals of the crystal.

    I have looked for the datasheets of the crystals we recommend but found none of them on the manufacturers homepages.
    Can you provide links to the datasheets? Or do you have any info on the ESR for the crystals?
    Customer is using an ACT PO4915HOGROFC-PF crystal 20pF and ESR=150R. Do you see that as a problem?

    Thanks
    Helge
  • Helge,


    I found the datasheet for the CTS crystal here:

    www.ctscorp.com/.../008-0308-0.pdf

    I wasn't able to find the datasheets for the ECS crystals, and the crystals may have changed series names or become obsolete. However, I believe it might be similar to these:

    www.ecsxtal.com/.../hc49ux.pdf
    www.ecsxtal.com/.../hc49u.pdf

    The ESR depends on the frequency, but the max ESR that these crystals will be about 300 Ohms for the 2.4576 MHz crystal, and about 50-55 Ohms for the 4.9152 MHz crystal. Based on the part number you provided, I believe they are using the latter frequency.

    One thing that I have seen is that often is that the boards work better with a capacitive load that is less than what is mentioned in the datasheet. With these crystals, it's often operated with about 20 pF of load capacitance and there is already some parasitic capacitance on the board which may take up some of the load.

    I would recommend having them drop the load capacitance to half of the value they are using now and seeing if this helps. Note that if they use a oscilloscope to monitor the crystal in/out pins, the probe adds an extra 10-20 pF to the load. It might be better just to monitor the /DRDY pin to check that the device is operating.

    As for the specific crystal that the customer is using, it seems that an ESR of 150 Ohms is higher than than the other recommended crystals operating at 4.9152 MHz. I was finally able to find the datasheet as one of the ACT surface mount crystals.

    After decoding the part number, it seems that the crystal is supposed to have a 16pF load capacitance (shown by the RO designation in the PO4915HOGROFC-PF part name). I would have them lower the capacitance to 10 pF or less to see if that helps, but I think the ESR may still be too high for that frequency.


    Joseph Wu
  • Thanks Joseph,

    The one we use on the ADS1241EVM is 120R and 20pF. And if I look through different manufacturer on 4.9152MHz an ESR between 120 and 150R look common.

    I have also recommended the customer to lower the capacitors to 16pF.

    See direct mail for more info.

    //Helge
  • Helge,


    Thanks for the email. There are a few things that I want to point out. In the last post, you mention that reflowing the solder help solve the problem. That's likely to be a cold solder joint and I'd think of that as a problem in their manufacturing.

    Second if they have a significant parasitic capacitance at either the XIN or XOUT pins, then this is an additive capacitance and you should really reduce the chip load capacitance to compensate for it. I'd consider dropping the load capacitance to 10pF or less. It should be easy to at least test it.

    If you look at the EVM schematic, you'll see that at XIN C21 is only 12pF for the crystal which is rated to a 20pF load. I believe that C19 is used for the experimental kickstart and isn't a part of the circuit as a default. It does look like the ATS042 has a higher ESR, but I will say that the crystals recommended in the datasheet all list something lower. If you lower the capacitive load, it's likely that the crystal could take a higher ESR.


    Joseph Wu
  • Helge,

    Do you know if this customer question has been answered?

    I wanted to include something to this post so that other readers could benefit from this thread. I've already sent this to you, but there is an older application note on using crystal oscillators with the MSC12xx devices. While they are not the same as in the ADS1241, they are very similar.

    Of particular note is section 8.3 of the application note. It describes startup issues with crystals and tests that can be run to determine how robust the crystal setup will be. There is a test method shown with data from Fox Electronics showing some of their results with the MSC12xx.

    Again, I'm sure you've passed this onto the customer. I just wanted to post this here so that others would be able to get the application note.

    Joseph Wu

    SBAA123_Using_Crystal_Oscillators_with_MSC12xx.pdf