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Original question:

DLPDLCR2000EVM: Maximize FPS with no regard to color

DLPDLCR2000EVM: How to control RGB-D Sequence

Joachim Mitin
Prodigy 20 points
Part Number: DLPDLCR2000EVM
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: DLP2000, DLP3010EVM-LC, DLPDLCR230NPEVM, DLP3010LC, DLPC3433

Tool/software:

Hi,

I've previously asked for settings for the DLPDLCR2000EVM to maximize fps, but imma start by saying I'm not sure whether it's the right Lightengine I want to use. I'll get back to that.

What i need is about 180-240 images per second. In equal intervals, Color is not so important, so my original idea was to use the 60Hz of the DLP2000 and simply split up my frame in RGB and boom tripled my framerate. That was before I learned that the EVM uses more than one Color cycle and the PMW signals to the LEDs aren't equally timed either. These are all settings for an optimal image under normal conditions, but that's not at all what I want to use it for. Also the image was bright enough to see but quite dark. 

(Sidenote: I couldn't find any documentation about whether the DMD can operate under constant acceleration of around 10G (for example when mounted on a spinning object))

Due to the brightness and FPS limitations of the 2000EVM i was looking into other EVMs like for example the DLPDLCR230NPEVM and would like to buy a fitting one. I've also looked at Pattern projectors like the DLP3010EVM-LC which from the stats seem like what I want - fast pattern projection, but quite frankly extremely overkill and costly, so I would prefer the equal RGB split. 

I've read what I could find of the documentation, but I don't want to make it unnecessarily costly, and want to find the minimum required hardware for the job. So 100+ lm would be nice but mainly I need a Pico projector capable of consistently projecting Patterns in high FPS and consistent RGB timings with one color cycle per frame and no Dark time.

So: 1. I need help determining the right hardware and whether it really fits my needs.

But then still remains the issue of programming it to have the equal timings and such. Since I hope to use DLP technology in the future for my product I think it's crucial for me to learn to properly deal with it. I've learned a lot by now, but I've studied mechanical engineering and don't have an entire embedded systems engineering degree, so I find it quite hard gathering together info piece by piece from high level documentations like the Programmers guide. 

So 2. my second question would be whether there's a comprehensive guide or online course I can read/partake in in order to learn to handle these genius little machines, which picks up from a hobby-level programmer to a decent enough understanding. Also I've seen Software for easier i2C control for more expensive EVMs is there any chance to use it on the dlpc2000 or similar?

I've thought about embedded systems courses outside of texas instruments as well, but quite frankly I'm missing the terminology to even know what exactly I'm looking for, so a word of guidance on what to focus on to learn would be highly appreciated. 

Sincere greetings 

  • 0
    TI__Genius 9570 points

    Hello User,

    Welcome back to the E2E forums and thank you for your interest in TI DLP® Technology.

    It sounds like you may want a light control specific EVM and for the lumens requirement of 100 lumens, the DLP3010EVM-LC may be your best choice still. The DLPLCR2000EVM does not have the light control features or the brightness you are looking for and is also being phased out from support.

    I am assigning this ticket to someone on the light control team so they can better assist you. 

    All of our EVM's will have software programmer guides to communicate with the controller chips to provide easier programming as well as GUIs to help control the EVM. 

    In terms of resources you can check out these video series:

    https://www.ti.com/video/series/precision-labs/ti-precision-labs-dlp-labs-technology.html

    https://www.ti.com/video/series/precision-labs/ti-precision-labs-dlp-labs-light-control.html

    Regards,

    Alex Chan

  • 0 in reply to Alexander Chan
    Prodigy 20 points

    Hi Alex,

    Many thanks for the Guides, I'll definitely look into them!

    Could you briefly explain to me why a light control EVM is necessary, as in why isn't it possible on other evms to control the duty cycle etc ? Is it the DLPC? 

    I'm asking because I would like to make my design into a product with hopefully the demand for mass production, in other words 700$ for a prototype ok, but are there technical limitations that keep me from utilizing this at a lower cost for a final product-production?

    Sincerely

    Joachim Mitin

  • 0 in reply to Joachim Mitin
    TI__Prodigy 365 points

    Hello Joachim,

    Please expect a delay in response due to the holidays in the US. We will get back to you soon.

    Thank you for your patience.



    Regards,
    Kirthi Vignan.

  • 0 in reply to Kirthi Vignan Yellakonda
    Prodigy 20 points

    Hi again,

    I hope you had a great start in the new year! 

    Thanks again for the Videos you've sent me, they seem to be rather general in their information, but still somewhat helpful.
    I specifically want to know though how to tell, whether it's possible to controll the colorcycle/PMW duration of the LEDs. and what frequency the projector can handle. Are these features exclusive to the LightControl EVMs? And if so, is it dependent on the DLPC, firmware, both, or the entire design in general?


    To specify my needs mentioned earlier, I would need an projection device capable of displaying color in 180-240 fps. The fps and Color frames are independent of each other, so 60fps in red + 60 green + 60 blue would be ideal. 80 Fps each would provide higher resolution, but aren't necessary. 
    For more brightness I could use more projectors, or other Optical Engines (?)

    From what I've seen most DLP-Evms come without an optical engine, I appreciate that you've linked manufacturers of fitting optical engines, but none of them seem to offer them for sale, I suppose they only sell them via request and probably only in higher number of pieces. Can you confirm this, or should I try to reach out to them? 

    Physically it should be possible for any DMD to satisfy my requirements with ease and I don't have the skill to design my own optical engine.

    So in summary: 

    I would like help to figure out the cheapes option to satisfy the requirements, without beeing overkill and unnecessarily expensive.
    I'm not an optical engineer, so having optics I can use out of the box would be required, or a way to obtain such.

    Sincerely

    Joachim Mitin

  • 0 in reply to Joachim Mitin
    TI__Genius 11880 points

    Hello Joachim,

    I'm going to include someone from our display team as well to determine if your needs can be met with their controllers.

    The frame rate you are looking at should be possible with cheaper DMDs and you don't necessarily need a light control solution to achieve the rates you're looking at.

    The biggest question is about your application, usually light control solutions are implemented for machine vision or 3D printing solutions that need FAST rates of patterns being displayed or higher illumination power specifications of the DMD itself.

    Are your only requirements as you mentioned below? 

    Joachim Mitin said:
    my needs mentioned earlier, I would need an projection device capable of displaying color in 180-240 fps. The fps and Color frames are independent of each other, so 60fps in red + 60 green + 60 blue would be ideal. 80 Fps each would provide higher resolution, but aren't necessary.

    Is there a specific resolution you're trying to meet? Or a light power? What is your anticipated form-factor in your end product?

    Best,

    Aaron

  • 0 in reply to Aaron Black
    Prodigy 20 points

    Hi,

    thanks for the quick response!

    Yes as long as RGB timings and duration are consistant, as to use them to triple the framerate equally, that would meet my main requirements.

    EDIT:Just to make sure I express myself correctly: by the 60fps for each color I meant after each other, as in RGBRGBRG.... wher one "frame" consists of one sub-frame in each color so RGB, like older color wheel versions of DLP projjectors (i know equal RGB colorwheels are scarce too). 

    The only other criteria would probably be, that it has a focus distance of around 20 - 60cm (8 - 24 inches).

    A broad range of focus depth (if you say it like that(?)) would be preferred, with that I mean the image staying relatively sharp over a broader range of distance e.g. almost sharp image from 27-42cm distance from optical origin.

    Light power would be a second priority property, so If possible could you name two light engines for a lower end product, which just works, and secondly a higher end that's brighter? So while not my main concern, this is of course something that largely impacts the usability/experience.

    As for resolution I'll take what I can get and in terms of form factors I am quite flexible as well. I literally base(d) my design around the light engine, I'm gonna make it fit. ;)

    Same goes for power consumption, throw ratio or offset.

    I hope this helps. 

    Many greetings 

    Joachim 

  • 0 in reply to Joachim Mitin
    TI__Genius 11880 points

    Hello Joachim,

    Light power and focus depth are directly proportional, keep that in mind.

    I would advise that you take a look at the Optics information we have available through ti.com here. Read through that overview page to get an idea of what's necessary. Additionally, the DLP Product's Overview page has a section near the bottom for Technical Resources that can be helpful.

    For an idea of controllers for a lower end product I'll have to hand this to someone else on my team - give them a little bit to respond as I do this.

    Light engines are handled by 3rd party vendors which you can find in our 3rd party search tool here - https://www.ti.com/tool/DLP-OMM-SEARCH.

    Best,

    Aaron

  • +1 in reply to Aaron Black
    TI__Expert 7105 points

    Hello Joachim,

    The biggest reason we recommend the light control chipsets (and manufacture them) for these applications, is out of necessity for consistent timings, light output, and color consistency. While you may be able to get similar frame rates from a display chipset, you do not have all the control with respect to video timings and such as you would from a light control chipset. When used in their LC(light control) modes, our LC chipsets specifically bypass all the hardware and software image processing in order to guarantee pixel level accuracy according to what you are expecting. While the EVM is on the pricier side, the DLP3010LC chipset cost is ~$97.48.

    The DLP3010EVM-G2 uses a similar chipset to the DLP3010EVM-LC however is meant for display applications. This does not give you control over timing/pwm and other consistencies which would be typically needed in an LC application (link)

    Best,

    Max

  • 0 in reply to Maximus Rusi
    Prodigy 20 points

    Hi Max,

    Thank you very much, this is somewhat the conclusion that I came to as well during the discussion here. Also thanks for pointing out the price of the chipset alone. 

    One last thing, just so I understand it correctly:

    Other control chipsets like the DLPC3433 of the Gen2 Evm just aren't made for that type of control and whilst the dmd is physically capable of doing what I want, the chipset is hardware optimized for displaying normally and therefore timings and Colorsequences are hardcoded. Is this understanding correct?

    Otherwise this does resolve my question, thank you very much :)

  • 0 in reply to Joachim Mitin
    TI__Expert 7105 points

    Hi Joachim,

    The display chipset came first and as we recognized a need for light control applications with more control we redesigned the chipset to meet it. There is a combination of hardware and software limitations which the DLPC347x chipset resolve.

    Glad we could resolve your issue and we look forward to being a part of your end product. Please feel free to reach out if you have any issues in your design process.

    Best,

    Max

  • 0 in reply to Maximus Rusi
    Prodigy 20 points

    Thanks a lot so far, I'll stay in touch if I encounter any more problems I'm unable to make sense of.

    Greetings Joachim