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New motor drive method for Instaspin program

Other Parts Discussed in Thread: INSTASPIN-BLDC

Hello 

 I am interested in how to improve Magnet type Brushless Motor efficiency and power..
My proposal is explained the following paper;  http://eb-cat.ds-navi.co.jp/enu/jtekt/tech/ej/img/no166e/166e_04.pdf

 The method or scheme is shown on the page 15; "5.1.1 Control of current conduction angles and phases" .
It will be easier to understand by the Fig 7, 8,9.

 The motor efficiency and power will be improved by this method and torque ripple will be greater,  then this method should be applied to high speed fan and pump application such as e-turbo or ISG.  

 The above driving method is realized and applied with Hall Element.  Is it possible to have this "Control of current conduction angles and phases" without position sensor?

 

  • The improvement shown with this method is in comparison to a non-PWM 120 degree (Trapezoidal 6-step commutation). It looks to be an improvement but you could also look at doing true FOC. That would be my first inclination. We have had excellent success using IS-FOC on high speed motors to drive best dynamic response and excellent efficiency.

    One of the challenges of course in this sort of application (low voltage / high current) is in dealing with the current measurements. For FOC you require 2 or 3 (single shunt reconstruction is possible but much more difficult and often not worth the effort). Because of the high current the shunt approach can become expensive (and result in efficiency losses) almost to the point that phase current measurements using hall sensors (LEM is a popular brand) start to make sense. But this is at cost increase to the bus current measurement approach that is standard in 6-step methods. Also, with FOC, to get maximum bus utilization to compare to full BLDC output power you need to be able to over-modulate. To still take current samples for the feedback in this area you will require the 3rd shunt (or 2 phase). Again, more cost.

    Back to your original question: Is it possible to have this "Control of current conduction angles and phases" without position sensor?

    I believe of course the answer here is YES. Considering that the profile for this motor is of normal operation at higher frequencies, a Bemf (phase voltage) based observer could be used. Something like InstaSPIN-BLDC would be very robust. This would give you the commutation states. However, in the paper's implementation the modulation/commutation is adjusted so that for 2/3 of the duty cycle you aren't actually PWM'ing the FET, but just leaving it full on/off.
  • I am sorry I have made the new thread independently.
    I should have made it under "C2000™ Microcontrollers InstaSPIN Motor Solutions Forum".
    Can we move to there or can we set the links?

    The following is my comments;
    We can get the better/best motor performance with IS-FOC, but I think it does not care the inverter switching losses and stater core losses neither.

    Concerning the current censor,
    (1)under 1kW/12V --> shunt resistor
    (2)over few kW --> Hall effect IC on the PCB is avilable.
    www.tme.eu/.../ramka_7732_EN_pelny.html
    www.sparkfun.com/.../8882
    * Hall element is not so expensive for 10kWaround/48V motors.

    I would like to compare the system efficiency and start torque by INSTA SPIN software;
    (a) With hall element position sensor system; original.
    (b) Position sensor-less system with salient multi-pole rotor and operation mode selector; start with FOC, then to "Control of current conduction angles and phases" and so on.

    Regards.
  • Thanks for the reply.

    I am sorry I made the new forum independently. I should have made it under "insta spin forum". Can we move to it or link the forum?

    By the way, here is my comments.
    I agree IS-Foc is excellent, it gives us the best motor perfomance,but it does not care the inverter swiching losses.

    Concerning the current sensor, hall element type sensor is available; www.tme.eu/.../ramka_7732_EN_pelny.html
    And this is not so expensive with 10kW around motor with 48V.
    Of course, 1kW around motor uses shunt resistor.

    And the following is my request to compare the motor system efficiency and start torque with the Insta Spin software;
    (a) With hall element position sensor and "Control of current conduction angles and phases"
    (b) Rotor position sensor-less drive and "Control of current conduction angles and phases" by sailent multi-pole rotor motor and mode change; FOC at start, then to 120deg. conduction and so on.

    Regards.
  • You can compare the system efficiencies and starting torque by testing both solutions. We don't have anything to use for current conduction technique. Using hall position sensors for start-up is likely to provide a better start-up experience with higher torque in a more controlled fashion.

    b) I'm sorry, I don't have much to offer regarding this topic. I think it would be challenging to change to a 120deg conduction while using InstaSPIN-FOC.
  • My proposal is especially for multi-poles motor.
    In this case, Starting torque or reverse rotation will be minimized with IS-FOC.
    Speed range such as 0 rpm - xxxx rpm with rotor poles is very important . Sailent property is also important.
    And the drive mode should be changed to "Control of current conduction angles and phases" in order to have low inver loss and low EMC emission.