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TPS25830A-Q1: USB Charging and data communication

BP
Prodigy 140 points
Part Number: TPS25830A-Q1
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: TPS25751, TPS25750

Hello Experts

I am posting again here to get some clarity.

In my application there is a board which will receive data from the Samsung A8 tablet. Tablet will send data to my board using USB2.0 (DP, DM)  lines of TYPE C port.

I want to design tablet charging and data communication circuit on my board. When the tablet is connected through its Type C port, my circuit should act like a DFP port (power source provider).

But the Tablet will be host (In terms of data role) and my micro-controller on the board will be the USB device receiving data from the tablet.

Maximum charging current required is 5V and 3A.

How can I do this ?

I checked TPS25830A-Q1 and it looks like one possible solution. According to data sheet It is a DFP device so it will provide charging power to the tablet.

But how will Tablet confirm  that it is connected to a DFP device ? Which configuration pins on TPS25830 decides it ?

Also how data roles will be decided by the tablet (who is host and who is device) ?

Please suggest whether it can solve my purpose.

  • 0
    TI__Genius 11265 points

    Hello BP,

    TPS25830A-Q1 is a Type-C controller without Power Delivery capabilities.  Power Delivery is required to perform the data role swap required to be a power source/data device (upstream facing port).

    The power and data role are initially determined by each device's forcing condition on the CC pins.  DFPs/power sources will pull up CC (Rp) whereas UFP/power sinks will pull down CC (Rd).  In a Power Delivery application, the two devices communicate over the CC pin to perform a data swap role (if desired).  TPS25830A-Q1 does not have this capability.

    While we don't currently support data role swap on our automotive PD controllers today, it is something we are working to implement.  Please take a look at TPS25762-Q1 (single port PD) or TPS25772-Q1 (dual port PD) and see if they fit your design needs.

    Regards,
    Eric

  • 0 in reply to Eric Hartigan
    Prodigy 140 points

    Thanks Eric

    Automotive grade port controller is not needed for my application. Any other solution can be used.

    Also during communication data role swap negotiation is not needed. The Tablet will always be Host and my Board will always be device using DP & DM lines only.

    Can this be fixed using configuration lines so that when Tablet is connected it assumes the role of host and my board starts in device mode and also provide charging power to the tablet ?

    In this case can TPS25830 be used ?

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Genius 11265 points

    Hi BP,

    This does not sound like a good application for TPS25830A-Q1.  It is not intended to be used in such a manner.

    Type-C ports cannot initially be power source in device mode.  By being power source, the port is required to initially be data host, then perform a data role swap.

    Since you don't require an automotive grade device, I am assigning this ticket to Raymond.  He is better suited to help you find the appropriate device.

    Regards,
    Eric

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP, 

    For DRD (Dual Role Data) Type-C applications you will need to use a PD (Power Delivery) controller to be able to process/initiate swap the data roles with the connected port partner. For your application, can you re-elaborate what should be the final power and data role from the port perspective? 

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond Lin

  • 0 in reply to Raymond Lin
    Prodigy 140 points
    Hello Raymond
    Thanks for the response.

    In my application there is a board which will receive data from the Samsung A8 tablet. 

    Tablet will send data to my board using USB2.0 (DP, DM)  lines of the TYPE C port. USB 3.0 SS data lines are not used for the communications.

    I want to design a tablet charging and data communication circuit on my board. Maximum charging current required is 5V and 3A.

    When the tablet is connected through its Type C port, my circuit should act like a DFP port (power source provider) and start charging.

    But the Tablet will be the host (In terms of data role) and my micro-controller on the board will be the USB device (USB 2.0) receiving data from the tablet.

    Final power role of port in my circuit will be power provider and data role will be device (tablet will be host )

    How can I achieve this ?

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP,

    For this application I recommend using TPS25751, this is a PD controller with a easy to use GUI to develop the PD configuration including the preferred data role. You can find more details on the device itself on its main product page (https://www.ti.com/product/TPS25751) or on the EVM user guide for GUI tutorials (https://www.ti.com/lit/ug/slvucp9a/slvucp9a.pdf?ts=1716434920746&ref_url=https%253A%252F%252Fwww.ti.com%252Fproduct%252FTPS25751)

    The TPS25751 GUI has a questionnaire page to select the system block diagram, highest power for source/sink, preferred power role, preferred data role, supported USB speed and other features. For your application all you have to do is set Question 4 (What is the preferred power role?), Question 5 (What is the supported USB Highest Speed?) and Question 6 (Do you have a preferred data role?) as shown below:

    What this does is when TPS25751 is connected to a PD capable far-end device, it will attempt to be a source as well as initiating a data role swap to become UFP (device). If TPS25751 ever connects as a sink, it will also try to become source by initiating a swap to source message with the connected port partner. 

    Let me now if you have any further questions or concerns! 

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond Lin

  • 0 in reply to Raymond Lin
    Prodigy 140 points

    Thanks Raymond for guiding me.

    I will study the data sheet before asking any queries if  needed.

  • 0 in reply to Raymond Lin
    Prodigy 140 points

    Hi Raymond

    After reading TPS25751 datasheet, my understanding is that I can configure it for my application through GUI tool which will generate binary image which will be programmed into the EEPROM. TPS25751 will read this configuration data every time it is powered on over I2C lines. Is my understanding correct ?

    If it is correct then how do i program EEPROM on my production board. Through TPS25751 EVM or from other external EEPROM programmers ?

    Can I use TPS25750 also as it looks similar to TPS25751 ?

    Is there any other total hardware solution available which does not require firmware programming ?

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP,

    BP said:
    After reading TPS25751 datasheet, my understanding is that I can configure it for my application through GUI tool which will generate binary image which will be programmed into the EEPROM. TPS25751 will read this configuration data every time it is powered on over I2C lines. Is my understanding correct ?

    Yes that is correct. Whenever TPS25751 boots up it will read and load the PD configuration from the EEPROM. The PD configuration image is generated as a full flash binary through the GUI. It is also possible the load the PD configuration using an External Controller via the I2C target line on TPS25751. More details on this flashing method can be found in the Technical Reference Manual: https://www.ti.com/lit/pdf/slvucr8 

    BP said:
    If it is correct then how do i program EEPROM on my production board. Through TPS25751 EVM or from other external EEPROM programmers ?

    You will need to use an external EEPROM programmer to flash the EEPROM. For testing/validation we typically use the Aardvark adapter for flashing the EEPROM (https://www.totalphase.com/products/aardvark-i2cspi/?GA_network=g&GA_device=c&GA_campaign=19671691348&GA_adgroup=149567408521&GA_target=&GA_placement=&GA_creative=647807793976&GA_extension=&GA_keyword=totalphase%20aardvark&GA_loc_physical_ms=9026941&GA_landingpage=https://www.totalphase.com/products/aardvark-i2cspi/&ga_keyword_match=e&ga_ad_position=&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIpbGOmYCnhgMVaDjUAR3-xQ2pEAAYASAAEgIeAPD_BwE) 

    BP said:
    Can I use TPS25750 also as it looks similar to TPS25751 ?

    TPS25750 is the predecessor to TPS25751, for new designs we recommend using TPS25751. For more details on migrating to TPS25751 please refer to this FAQ page: https://e2e.ti.com/support/power-management-group/power-management/f/power-management-forum/1346998/faq-tps25751-migrating-from-the-tps25750-to-the-tps25751 

    BP said:
    Is there any other total hardware solution available which does not require firmware programming ?

    Our PD controllers require firmware programming based on the user's application, that way you can set what USB speed the PD will advertise, tying different events to GPIO to control other peripherals, etc. 

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond Lin

  • 0 in reply to Raymond Lin
    Prodigy 140 points

    Hello Raymond

    I have gone through all the details as suggested by you.

    Can you review my schematic ? It will be very helpful for me.

    How can I mail you on private channel ?

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP, 

    You can send me your schematic via direct message here on e2e. You can also refer to this preliminary schematic checklist for TPS25751 as a starting reference: 2046.Schematic Checklist Rev 1p0.xlsx

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond Lin

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP, 

    Regarding your query on BC1.2: 

    "Do i need to use BC1.2 lines also as i am not sure whether my Samsung Tablet  A8/A9 supports BC 1.2 or not ?

    I am just connecting USB 2.0 DP and DM data lines from Type C USB port to USB 2.0 Type B connector to my MCU.."

    BC1.2 is an optional feature on TPS25751, if you do not need your system to support BC1.2 then you do not need to route DP/DM from the Type-C connector to GPIO4/5 of TPS25751. If you do wish to support BC1.2 charging then you'll need to route DP/DM to GPIO4/5 as well as setting up the configuration in the GUI. 

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond Lin

  • 0 in reply to Raymond Lin
    Prodigy 140 points

    Hello Raymond

    Thanks for reviewing my schematic.

    Just one last query, as i am not using high voltage node PPHV for charging or sinking. Can I leave this pin floating or does it need to be bypassed with capacitors ?

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP, 

    If PPHV is not being used you can ground this pin. Just for clarification, is this design with TPS25751 meant to be a 5V source only design? 

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond Lin

  • 0 in reply to Raymond Lin
    Prodigy 140 points

    Hello

    Yes, this is only 5V source and USB 2.0 data.

    Thanks again for helping me out.

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP, 

    Ground PPHV should be no issue here then. For configuring TPS25751 you can refer to Section 3 in the TPS25751 User Guide on using the GUI: https://www.ti.com/lit/ug/slvucp9a/slvucp9a.pdf?ts=1717169460000&ref_url=https%253A%252F%252Fwww.ti.com%252Ftool%252FTPS25751EVM 

    I'll go ahead and close this thread, please open a new thread for additional questions or concerns! 

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond Lin

  • 0 in reply to Raymond Lin
    Prodigy 140 points

    Hi Raymond,

    I am unable to procure TPS25751D part no

    So I am planning to use TPS25751S part.

    As I am not using High voltage PPHV, Can I leave VSYS, GATE_VSYS and GATE_VBUS signals floating ?

  • 0 in reply to BP
    TI__Mastermind 34616 points

    Hi BP, 

    Yes you can leave those pin floating if you're only intended to use TPS25751S as a 5V source only PD controller. 

    Thanks and Regards,

    Raymond LIn