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TPS2583XAQ1EVM-147: Trying to use TPS52830 to Power Delivery and Data.

Daniel Vera
Prodigy 50 points
Part Number: TPS2583XAQ1EVM-147
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: TPS25830A-Q1, , TPS25751, TPS25730

Tool/software:

Hi,

Did buy a evaluation module TPS2583XAQ1EVM to build a PD + Data board if all works good I'll make my own board.

Want make a board that could provide power to tablet or cell phone and at the same time the tablet or phone see a device connected, like keyboard or mouse.

Think it's could be possible using TPS25830A chip.

Couldn't reach my target using evaluation board. I did connect a mouse using female to female adapter connected on J4 and providing power with VBUS.

I did let open CTL1 and CTL2 to reach Type-C (3 A) + CDP Mode.

About J5 & J6, I'm little confusing with Rd and Ra, but tested different combinations.

Thanks!

  • 0
    TI__Mastermind 46151 points

    Hello Daniel,

    The TPS25830A-Q1 is not intended to be used with Type-C to Type-A cables. Before we proceed any further, let's check if the TPS25830A-Q1 is the appropriate device for you.

    The TPS25830A-Q1 is for automotive end applications. Do you require an automotive Type-C charger?

    Is 15W of power all that is needed?

    BR,

    Seong

  • 0 in reply to Seong Kim
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hi Seong,

    Thanks!
    Yes, it's enough 15W to charge tablet/phone.

    Regards!

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    Prodigy 50 points

    It's to make a usb hub with custom layout.

    I need charge tablet at same time.

    Thanks!

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    TI__Mastermind 46151 points

    Hi Daniel,

    I will look into this and let you know.

    BR,

    Seong

  • 0 in reply to Seong Kim
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hi Seong,

    Thanks!

    Need resolve how to usb hub talk to CC lines to said "I'm a power delivery"
    USB hub, usb2.0, it's done.

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    TI__Mastermind 46151 points

    Hi Daniel,

    Is a type-C to type-A cable support required? Or only type-C to type-C cable support is fine?

    BR,

    Seong

  • 0 in reply to Seong Kim
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hi Seong,

    Yes, type-C to type-C to connect usb hub to tablet/cellphone.

    The downstream facing ports of hub are type-A.

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    TI__Mastermind 46151 points

    Hello Daniel,

    If I understand correctly, your system requirements are:

    1. Integrate a type-C charger device to connect and charge a tablet, for example, using a a type-C to type-C cable.
    2. Integrate a USB HUB so that you can also connect and charge another UFP Sink device, such as a keyboard or mouse.
    3. Ensure proper data role swap so that the tablet can act as a host and a keyboard or mouse can be used with it 

    The reason why you could not get this to work using a TPS2583XAQ1EVM-147 is because the J4 type-A receptacle does not have a voltage rail connected to the VBUS pin (pin 1), so your mouse or keyboard was not being powered. See snip from the TPS2583XAQ1EVM-147 schematic below (taken from Figure 2-1 in the EVM User's Guide).

    You did not confirm if this board is for an automotive end equipment. We do not have automotive-grade type-c 15W chargers in our portfolio that makes data role swap simple. 

    If an automotive-grade type-c charger is not required, perhaps we could recommend a more suitable part from our commercial-grade type-c charger portfolio that can easily meet your system requirements. Please confirm if a commercial-grade device is acceptable.

    BR,

    Seong

  • 0 in reply to Seong Kim
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hello Seong,

    1. Integrate a type-C charger device to connect and charge a tablet, for example, using a a type-C to type-C cable.
      ->Yes
    2. Integrate a USB HUB so that you can also connect and charge another UFP Sink device, such as a keyboard or mouse.
      ->Yes
    3. Ensure proper data role swap so that the tablet can act as a host and a keyboard or mouse can be used with it
      ->Yes, tablet must works all time in host mode and receive power from the external PCB at same time while I using mouse or keyboard. External PCB have a usb hub extends the possibilities to connect more than one device. Some of that devices are custom.

    I saw that pin out over J4 and put Vbus to the device connected there.

    Commercial-grade it's ok for me.

    Thanks!!!

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    TI__Genius 12665 points

    Hi Daniel,

    We can work to recommend a commercial grade device for you. Can you help confirm my understanding of your board design?

    Your board has:

    1. 1 UFP Type-C port that connects to and can charge a tablet/phone.
    2. 1+ DFP Type-A port that connects to and can power a mouse/keyboard peripheral.

    Which port on your board are you looking for a device recommendation on? Is it the Type-C port or Type-A port?

    Please correct my understanding if needed.

    Best,

    Alex

  • 0 in reply to Alex Liu
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hi Alex,

    I'll explain me using schematic:

    Image it's better than thousand words!
    USB hub it's really done and devices too.
    So I'm looking for device that could manage CC lines to charge tablet while using the devices that plugged in the hub.

    I'll go to holidays until 2025/01/15.
    Wish you have a good new year!

    Thanks!!!

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    TI__Genius 12665 points

    Hi Daniel,

    Thanks for the diagram explaining the application. Let me re-assign this thread to our team member handling the appropriate devices. They will be able to help you.

    Happy New Year!

    Best,

    Alex

  • 0 in reply to Alex Liu
    TI__Mastermind 37855 points

    Hi Daniel,

    Do you need PD for this port? For simple power and USB, we would recommend the TPS25751 PD controller.

    For the power only port, you can look into a second TPS25751, or the TPS25730.

    Thanks and Regards,

    Chris

  • 0 in reply to Christopher Lim1
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hi Alex,

    No need PD feature over usb ports because just for connect conventional usb 2.0 devices.

    Our design no use an internal battery, then charger battery feature of TPS25751 have no sense in this case, if I don't wrong, so select TPS25751S version could be right because no integrate the gates to charge a battery.

    Updating the schematic:

    Updated

    Thanks!

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    Prodigy 50 points

    About down step voltage regulator with TPS564257DRL it's done and working.

    Regards

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    TI__Mastermind 37855 points

    Hi Daniel,

    If you only need to source 5-V, then the TPS25751S should work in your application. Does the PD port need to be able to sink? Why is a PD port needed here?

    Thanks and Regards,

    Chris

  • 0 in reply to Christopher Lim1
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hi Chris,

    Does the PD port need to be able to sink?

    The board sink power from tablet/cellphone? No, because can not provide power as long time of use. If I don't understood bad your question.

    Why is a PD port needed here?

    To provide power to tablet/cellphone and operate long time all the schematic. The power comes from external source, main source, and loads peripherals connected and charge battery of tablet/cellphone. So I need chip that mange CC lines to tell to tablet/cellphone "I could provide the power, use me!" and at same time still work with the peripherals connected to USB hub.

    Thanks!

    Regards.

  • 0 in reply to Daniel Vera
    TI__Mastermind 37855 points

    Hi Daniel,

    I would take a deeper look at your type-C requirements if you do not need multiple power or data roles, and don't need to supply >15-W of power from the port.

    Type-C PD is primarily used for one of the following:

    1. Multiple power roles (sourcing and sinking)

    2. Multiple Data roles (DFP and UFP)

    3. Alternate modes

    4. >15-W source/sinking

    5. needing a combination of Power Source with Data UFP,  or Power Sink with Data DFP

    If you do not need any of these, you may want to look into getting a type-c only, non-pd controller. I primarily support USB-C PD controllers (devices like the TPS25751) so can only really help there, but if you do not need any of the requirements above, the IC might be overkill.

    To answer your questions, the TPS25751 can manage the power connection to a peripheral and would manage the port connection only on the type-c port. It can manage the CC lines and advertise a source port. If you look deeper into the Type-C spec, you may notice that for "sources", Pullup resistors will be advertised on the port. The TPS25751 will do this, but a PD controller is not required to expose pullup resistors.

    The main reason you may need a PD controller in this case is for option 5, where the tablet/cellphone wants to sink power and be a Data DFP. For USB-C PD, a device can enter a contract only as either a Power Source/Data DFP, or a Power Sink/Data UFP. After connection, it can make the desired power or data role swap to end up in the desired configuration, an the TPS25751 can support initiating and processing these swaps.

    The main difference between the S and D versions is internal vs. external high voltage power path. If you only need 5-V Source, the S version should be fine.

    Thanks and Regards,

    Chris

  • +1 in reply to Christopher Lim1
    Prodigy 50 points

    Hi Chris,

    Think that my situation is describes by point 5 and haven't a battery to charge in the board that need a high voltage path, then TPS25751S be the solution.

    If you are agree too I'll close this issue and make PCB board to testing.

    Thanks!!

    Regards.