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BQ78350-R1: Individual cell discharged

Part Number: BQ78350-R1
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: BQ76930, BQ78350, , EV2400

I have a battery that uses the BQ76930 AFE connected to 8 series cell packs (100Ah). The external balancing circuit is the same as in the application notes and set for 150mA. I am seeing batteries returned from an application in which they were probably sitting on the shelf for 4-5 months. Each has  one or two cells reading 0V and the rest are 3.2+/-V. I am not measuring any short circuits in the balancing circuit, so am assuming that the balancing circuit was being held on for a long period of time. Any thoughts as to what might be wrong?

  • Hi David,
    The bq76930 does not turn on or off cell balance by itself. The bq78350 does limited balancing according to its algorithm. If it is balancing and sees a cell go to low voltage it should turn off balancing and turn off the bq76930 which would also turn off balancing. Loss of communication between the bq76930 and bq78350 during balancing could leave the selected balancing on, but the system should continue to operate and likely drain all cells to VSHUT (< 3.2V/cell). Cells discharged to 0 would seem more likely from some defect or damage on the board. Look for resistive damage on the bq76930 inputs, leaking capacitors or contamination on the board. You should be able to see current as voltage across the input resistors, then it becomes more difficult to determine if it is into the IC, the capacitor or some other path. If you have opened the electronics pack to access the circuit (which is normal), try to load the board with the same mechanical torque and electrical bias as it experiences when in the system while looking for the currents. Looking for patterns in the discharged cells may be helpful. If the circuit is not showing a fault it has either cleared, was behaviorial which is unexpected, or may be outside the board. If you have it enabled, looking at the lifetime data from the bq78350-R1 may be informative. If you have access to packs which are not operating due to UV but cells have not gone to 0V, those may show some different clues also.
    I can't think of other suggestions at this point so I'm selecting "thinks resolved" although I realize your problem certainly is not. Please reply with what you find or with other questions. Your response may be helpful to other community members, and some may have other suggestions also.
  • Thanks for the insights. I am continuing to investigate the areas you recommended, but thought I would provide a schematic and dump of the data memory in hopes that another set of eyes on the data might help reach a conclusion quicker. The attached data is from a battery in which cell 7 was 0V. The rest of the cells are at about 3.2V. One thing I noticed is that when trying to collect data using the EV2400, I was unable to connect with BQ Studio at first. I finally disconnected the cells and connected a cell simulator with all cells set to 3.2V. It then connected every time. Not sure if that tells us anything about the problem, but it does raise the question as to why the EV2400 will not communicate with a battery with a dead cell in it. I also looked at the lifetime data and noticed some unusual data regarding other cells that leads me to believe that the lifetime might have had some bogus data in it that was never cleared when the battery was built. 2570.Gas Gauge.pdf

    DATA MEMORY.xls

  • Hi David,
    The schematic looks normal in the cell 7 area. With the cell simulator you should be able to see if there is leakage at QB7 through RB7 or a drop through RF7 which might be turning on the FET. If ther is a drop at RF7 you have to figure out if the current is going into the IC or CF7. If it is coming out RF6 it could be the cap or IC or contamination. If it is coming out R61 it is more likely the IC.
    The lifetime data may not be meaningful if it has leftovers, but it would look like cell 7 had the lowest maximum and never balanced. All the others may have balanced trying to match it. It may have had a leakage or loss from the beginning.
    No of FCC Updates 2
    Learned Full Charge Capacity 9848 down 512 mAh and
    FCC Learn Down 256 which would be the 2 cycles.
    Dod at EDV2 9709 is very low compared to default, it must have found a very low capacity probably each time.
    These all seem consistent with a cell going low, but don't tell why.

    The gauge will shut down if a cell voltage goes below
    Power Shutdown Shutdown Voltage 1750 mV
    So if it is shutting down it seems to indicate you are looking for a leakage and not an incorrect voltage reading.