AWR1642BOOST: mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2 ::: 1) Minimum number of ADC Samples 2) Setting the bandwidth of Tx signal

Hi,

The range of ADC samples is 64 to 4096. This is documented in the Radar Interface Control Document included in the Device Firmware Package.

The frequency slope −100 to +100 MHz/μs (resolution 0.0048 MHz/μs)

Frequency Start: 76 to 81 GHz (resolution 54 Hz)

Thank you

Cesar

Hi Cesar,

Thank you for your reply but I fear that this does not reply my queries so I request a revisit to my questions. I again re-state my queries in view of your above reply and request you to please extend guidance :

1)  Please refer the previous related question at URL : e2e.ti.com/.../894294

As guided in the above question, I referred "numAdcSamples" variable at location file:///C:/ti/mmwave_sdk_03_03_00_03/packages/ti/control/mmwavelink/docs/doxygen/html/structrl_profile_cfg__t.html

It states that : Valid range: 2 to MAX_NUM_SAMPLES

After your advice, I consulted Revision 1.7 of Radar Interface control Document. As a precise location has not been advised, so I searched the text  " ADC samples " in the pdf file. I found Table 5.20: AWR PROFILE CONF SB contents . This table also states 

PF NUM ADC SAMPLES :  Number of ADC samples to capture in a chirp for each RX

Valid range: 2 to MAX NUM SAMPLES,

As per your reply, the ADC sample range is 64 to 4096. I searched version 1.7 of Radar Interface control document again and I found Table 5.121: AWR DEV TESTPATTERN GEN SET SB contents. This table states the field :

TESTPATTERN PKT SIZE : Number of ADC samples to capture for each RX
Valid range: 64 to MAX NUM SAMPLES

This matches your reply but I do not think that Test Pattern Table is applicable in this case and besides, I have not not enabled test pattern nor I am setting any value for that.

I feel that for usual operation of mmwave Studio , Table 5.20 is applicable for setting the Profile config.

Therefore, I repeat my question :

In mmwave Studio tab " SensorConfig" , I found that I cannot set number of ADC samples less than 64. Please advise how can I set the number of ADC samples less than 64 in mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2. I particular, I wish to set the number of ADC samples to 8 or 4.

2)   Thank you for the following information; I did not know it, neither did I observe it in a TI document, may be I missed it or overlooked it or may be I did not at all come across it :

The frequency slope −100 to +100 MHz/μs (resolution 0.0048 MHz/μs)

Frequency Start: 76 to 81 GHz (resolution 54 Hz)

However, my question is :

3)  I wish to set the start the Tx frequency as 77 GHz and I wish to experiment with very short bandwidth, say 90 MHz or even less. Please advise how can I set this bandwidth (90 MHz or even lower) in mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2 ? Should I set it in tab " StaticConfig " of mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2 ? Or is there some other way to set the bandwidth of Tx signal ?

Please also advise that is there any lower limit of bandwidth that could be set for Tx signal ? If yes, then please advise TI document(s) stating that limit for the AWR1642 device, for TI Demo Visualizer and for mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2.

Thanking you in advance for your guidance and requesting an expeditious response please.

Regards

Hi Cesar,

You valuable reply to the above email is awaited and requested.

Regards

Hi

Sorry for the delay.

As per mmWave Studio team in version 2.0 the min number of ADC samples is limted to 64

In mmWave studio 2.1 this limitation is removed and the min number of ADC samples is limited to 2.

Please use mmWave studio 2.1

thank you
Cesar

Hi Cesar,

1)       I had submitted earlier that due to unknown reasons, mmwave Studio 2.1.0.0 was not working with DCA 1000 EVM.

However, after your above reply, I checked mmwave studio again and I found that newer mmwave Studio 2.1.1.0 has been made available.

I installed mmwave Studio 2.1.1.0 and good that it started working.

However, I again have the same limitation.

You advised that in mmwave Studio one can set ADC samples as low as 2.

However, I found that even mmwave studio 2.1.1.0 (that I just installed), I cannot set ADC samples (in SensorConfig tab) less than 64. This is the same limitation that we had in mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2.

Please advise how can I set number of ADC samples as low as 2 (or 4 or 8)  in mmwave studio 2.1.1.0 ?

2)       I wish to set the start the Tx frequency as 77 GHz and I wish to experiment with very short bandwidth, say 90 MHz or even less. Please advise how can I set this bandwidth (90 MHz or even lower) in mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2 ? Should I set it in tab " StaticConfig " of mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2 ? Or is there some other way to set the bandwidth of Tx signal ?

Please also advise that is there any lower limit of bandwidth that could be set for Tx signal ? If yes, then please advise TI document(s) stating that limit for the AWR1642 device, for TI Demo Visualizer and for mmwave Studio 2.0.0.2.

Thanks and regards

Alper,

This a function of the mmWave Studio software. The software has internal checks on the allowed values.

For example, the number of ADC samples in the Profile section of the "SensorConfig" tab has a range of 64 to 4096.

At this point, there is no way around this limitation. If I try to type any number lower than 64 in the box, when I move the cursor to another tab, the number immediately jumps up to 64. This limitation is still effective in mmWave Studio v2.1.1. I verified this behavior this morning.

Regarding the bandwidth, this is defined by the frequency slope of the chirp multiplied by the ramp end time. Please take these two factors into consideration when designed your chirp.

Regards,
Kyle

Hi Kyle,

Thank you for your response.

I just want to re-confirm, although you have stated it earlier :

Earlier, TI Official Cesar (in his 22 June, 2020 message) advised that the limitation of setting minimum ADC samples to 64 was removed in mmwave Studio 2.1.1.0. He referred TI mmwave Studio team in his reply.

However, in you reply of 10th July, 2020, you are advising that the limitation of minimum 64 ADC samples still exists in mmwave Studio 2.1.1.0 as well, like in previous mmwave Studio versions.

I feel a bit concerned that it is less likely that there was an inadvertent miscommunication between Cesar and TI mmwave Studio team. On the other hand, I know and you have also personally checked that the minimum number of ADC samples that could be set in mmwave Studio 2.1.1.0 is 64.

Can I request you to please once again contact TI mmwave Studio team and seek their comments, as earlier, they said that the limitation of minimum 64 ADC samples had been removed in mmwave Studio 2.1.1.0 and , as per them, the minimum number of ADC samples could be set as low as 2 in mmwave Studio 2.1.10.

I realize that this might be a bit of nuisance for you, possibly, however, it is quite critical for me, therefore I am requesting a re-visit to this issue.

Best regards

Hi Kyle,

Thank you very much for your valuable reply, this is really important that you told me this.

I am not closing this thread because I have hopefully, just a last query in this connection.

Moreover, I am posting in both threads because they are almost same and the I wish the info to be available on both threads for subsequnet readers. I will cloase the both threads together.

You advised above that :

Quote

BSS firmware supports a minimum number of ADC samples of 2.

UNQUOTE

Well I may be asking a very basic question, but I still ask and I request you to please extend guidance on that : Can you please advise and guide me ( may be at a broad level), that how can I use BSS to set number of ADC samples as 2 ?

I have following replies, please confirm about each of them individually that is it right or not, and if not right, then what is right ?

1- As I cannot use less than 64 ADC samples in mmwave Studio, then can I use mmwave Demo Visualizer for this purpose ? I understand that I cannot set number of ADC samples as 2 in mmwave Demo Visualizer ? Am I right ?

2- I understand that I cannot (easily) modify the code of demo visualizer to set the number of ADC samples as 2. Am I right ?
3- I understand that for using the BSS and to for setting ADC samples as 2, I need to use CCS ? I understand that I will probably need to make a CCS project and upload that into AWR1642 BOOST EVM. Am I right ?
If yes, then can you please extend some guidance on that? Can you refer one or more particular Lab(s) in this regard that will help me in modifying the ADC samples in BSS and setting them as 2, 4 or 8 etc ?

Regards

Hi Kyle,

Thank you for your elaborate reply and for your indication towards the relation between number of ADC samples and range resolution.

In fact, I may not use 2 ADC samples, but I am trying to establish a basic understanding of the FMCW radar principles, while considerign minimum or very less ADC samples.

I have been so far using raw ADC data through DCA1000 EVM and using my own offline post-processing algorithm on that data.

I have not (much) used the Out-of-Box demo. I fear that I will have difficulty in using that, probably especially with respect to refresh rate. But that would be another issue if I try to use Out-of-Box demo in live mode.

I rather intend to collect the raw ADC data by using CLI / Out-of-Box demo and use that raw ADC data it with my own algorithm. However, I fear that I will be troubled by the maximum data / buffer size for ADC data in that case. I have not faced that difficulty while using mmwave Studio + DCA1000 EVM as there I can collect significant amount of data.

I strongly suggest and recommend to TI to please soon remove the limitation of minimum 64 ADC samples in mmwave Studio so that one can set minimum number of ADC samples ( 2 as stated in SDK for CLI and / or in Radar Interface Document).

This will facilitate the user to have same functionality by using both the CLI / Out-of-Box Demo and mmwave Studio.

Thanks and regards