Multiple Profiles Used at the same time

Eric,

What device type are you interested in? ZLL only defines Lighting devices and the spec was written to IOP with HA. So a ZLL device can operate on a ZLL network or a HA network. Using the TI stack ZLL devices can also be developed to behave more like HA devices with HA device ID's and binding support.

So if you are interested in developing a Lighting device then you should consider starting with ZStack-Lighting-1.0.1, which will operate on HA and ZLL networks.

If you are developing a gateway or some other control device then you are probably better developing a HA device that is aware of ZLL device ID's.

Regards, TC.

Hello Yikai Chen Sir,

I want to implement Multiple profile application on CC2530, can you please help me how to do it,

i just want to integrate any two profile , will steps be similar to multiple end points integration if no then please let me know how to do multiple profile running on Zigbee cc2530,

for example GenericApp and HomeAutomation Sample light application to work simultaneously.

thanks and regards

Manish

Hi Manish,

As I know, you can't make two profile run simultaneously on CC2530? You say 

for example GenericApp and HomeAutomation Sample light application to work simultaneously.

It sounds like that you don't need two profile running on CC2530. If you can specify more clearly, I could give suggestions.

Hello Yikai Chen Sir,

I just want to know how two profile works simultaneously that's why I tried it with  one Home Automation SampleSwitch Application and another GenericApp the application is like that on key press an  event has generated for GenericApp and this event will call a function for sending match_descriptor_request() to another side where light and genricapp is implemented I am following the same steps as I did for Two endpoint working,

Now I just want to know how actually multiple profile works and if I go to CC2538 how will i implement Multiple profile as I havent got any document or links where I can find how to make multiple profile.

please help.3312.Source.zip  I am sending you the switch + Generic file find the attachment and let me know how to do it on cc2538.if possible.

Thanks and Regards

Manish

Hello Yikai Sir,

But on some links and ti web site it is being written that CC2538 supports multiple profile,what does it means ?

it supports but not simultaneously?

if it is true than, please let me know as I am about to purchase the CC2538 for multiple profiling application, that can simultaneously run SE,HA,ZLL and some other profile.

Thanks and regards

Manish

Hi Manish,

CC2538 should be no problem running two profile simultaneously but I have no experience on it. So, I suggest you to contact TI 

Hello Yikai Sir,

Thanks for your quick response,can you please give me the email Id of any of your colleagues in Ti so that  I may contact them and get information about the CC2538 , As I dont only need hardware but need technical support also that's why it is important to talk some one who has hands on experience over it and knows its possibilities well 

once again thanks for solving all my queries

Thanks and Regards

Manish

Hi Manish,

I am not TI employee. You can try to send friend request to Cetri/TopCat/TheDarkSide who are TI employee.

Hi,

I wanted to clarify few things.

First of all, Zigbee Cluster library as defined by the ZigBee Alliance defines a common set of library of 'telegrams' and methods to exchange application data. And that is profile agnostic. 

In fact, if you take a look at the ZigBee Home Automation specification you would notice that in the list of clusters there's also a 'Smart Energy' domain related cluster, ie Simple Metering.

Therefore a 'Smart Energy' type of application (like a smart plug) it is actually already supported in the HA thanks to the cluster library framework.

So, what is so peculiar about profiles which make them so unique? Profile defines application space which depend on the specific industry and operating company in that industry/segment, which translates into rules for device behavior for that eco-system, and that implies settings like security and techniques for device commissioning.

That is the reason why Smart Energy networks (typically owned by utilities) are different than Home Automation networks: different security settings. Or why ZLL is a slightly different profile than HA: different security key as well as different commissioning mechanism (touchlink vs easy-mode). Even though for instance, between HA and ZLL, the same cluster commands are sent OTA to control the light.

This being said, I also wanted to clarify that the ZLL spec mandates that ZLL devices must be able to join and participate to HA network, and they need to support touchlink and classical commissioning, as well as HA and ZLL security. Our ZLL stack fully supports this and we have this documented in our collateral document. Please take a look at the Z-stack Lighting Sample Application user's guide and look for 'classical commissioning'

If you take our ZLL light and and try to join that with an HA coordinator, you can join it and operate it flawlessly.

In regards to the coexistence with HA and SE, as mentioned, because of the different security policies that HA and SE mandate (each one with different Trust Centers of the network, or 'owners' of the respective eco-system), the devices would need to join and be part of two different networks sharing a single radio resource in time-multiplex. being part of two different networks, in typical applications, means duplicating stack and application database, as well as memory resources.

Our CC2538 bigger part has a huge flash and RAM capability and therefore can serve this purpose. So technically, it is feasible to use it and run multiple stack bases. 

However, please note that since there's a single radio, the device would have to share it between the two networks and this is sometimes a limitation for some of the requirements that the eco-system owner enforces, as we have been seeing in the recent years. This is the reason why we tell this beforehand to our customers as we want to be clear upfront and advise them of the implications and requirements dictated by the industry.

The ultimate solution would be that there is a single PAN network and applications that belong to different segment are harmonized and compatible in terms of settings. This will probably come in next years.

Before that, the only true solution without any sort of limitation and no time multiplex between networks, so that a full access to the radio resource is granted to the respective stack, is to use two radios.

I hope this clarifies the situation.

Thanks,

 TheDarkSide

Hello TheDarkSide ,

Thanks For your response I have been waiting for it, Thanks for Intimating me about the limitation of CC2538, From your description it is clear that Profile exists on the Hardware but will not Run simultaneously.

1. My question is How to port two Stack (Multiple Profile on CC 2538 ) as I have not found any document about porting and running of Multiple profiles over it.

2. You have mentioned about the 2 radio solution, Can we integrate CC 2538 with external Radio transceiver module, which make it to two Radios ?, with this solution we can run multiple profile Simulteneously?

3. Is it necessary to Run standard Profiles on CC 2538 can we Run one HA and Other any Customized Profile.? If yes then How?

4. you have mentioned about "Before that, the only true solution without any sort of limitation and no time multiplex between networks, so that a full access to the radio resource is granted to the respective stack, is to use two radios." will this solution come on Same hardware i.e CC 2538 or you will go for Some other Hardware means design will be same or changed I am asking this question because if I go with CC 2538 in my product so I need not to change my design in Future.

Thanks and Regards

Manish.

Hi,

please note that the limitation of running multiple profile (or dual networks, let's call it like this since that is what de-facto is), is that the device would need to share the radio resources between the two networks. Which means that you need to time share the radio receiver. So configurations like router-router, or router-coordinator are not recommended. At the same time, configurations like end device-router or end device-coordinator make sense in case the device is a pretty quit end device and needs to send data only few times a day. Because what happens is that if the device is very chatty, it would steal the receiver from the coordinator or router in the other PAN and therefore the coordinator or router effectiveness in routing packets in the network can be affected.

Bottom line, it depends highly on the use case whether having a dual network on the same radio is a viable approach or not.

To answer your questions:

1. What you can do is to build a dual stack image (residing in two separate parts of the flash and using different RAM area). On each image, you would need to implement some sort of image dispatcher that tosses the PC on the other stack image entry point. The work required is not trivial and involves system aspect consideration.
2. We advise to use two wireless MCUs (can be two CC2538 or two CC2530). CC2538 is the high performance Wireless MCU ZigBee part, while the CC2530 is the value line wireless MCU ZigBee side. Yes, with this solution you can run two profile simultaneously and with no limiation
3. You can run manufacturer specific profile or standard profile. As mentioned profile defines security policies, commissioning procedures and rules for device ID. You can still use the standard cluster library but modify to your own profile ID. Please check the SimpleDescriptionFormat_t structure, where profile ID field is defined. 
4. CC2538 is our current performance line ZigBee part. Higher memory, higher flash, CM3 core, same RF and power performance as CC2530/CC2531. It is the obvious choice if you have high application requirements. I encourage anyway you get in contact with a local TI representative for more information on our roadmap, if you are interesting in getting an understanding of the best part for your design in the applicable timeframe of your interest. 

Thanks,

TheDarkSide

Hello Yikai Sir,

How Are you?

Its Been Long to talk to you , 

I have few issue and hope to get Solution from you.

1. I want to send the Text Message in HA profile Using  AF_DataRequest() can it be possible , as i Am using reserved Cluster Id . That are available in ZCL cluster Library.

2. if it is not possible using AF_DataRequest() how can i Send the text data in Zigbee HA profile.

3. If it is possible using Only manufacture Specific Cluster ID than How we can Test it before getting one. As we want to test our Appilcation for such Cluster.

Please let me know about following issue, My Main task and need is to send some text String in HA profile,

Thanks and regards 

Manish

Hi Manish,

It is no problem to send text data on HA profile. Just like you described, you can use reserved Cluster ID to do this.

Hello Yikai Sir,

I have done the Same have used the reserved Cluster and Send the data using AF_DataRequest(), but it is genrating the ZCL_event where i have written the 

case AF_INCOMING_MSG_CMD: 
SmartINetHB_ProcessMSGCmd( MSGpkt );

break;

I have written this snippet on light side and sending data from switch, I am sending the data on reserved cluster but on same endpoint where Light code is written will it work or i may try some thing else, if it is ok Can you please give me some Snippet or reference code to do such implementation.

and One more thing How are you?

please give me Suggestion.

thanks regards

manish.

I am fine, Thanks. Your pseudo-code looks fine. Do you have any problem deploying it?

Nice to here it from you,

1. When, I am sending data from AF_DataRequest(), i am not getting that event generation on remote node.

2. zclSampleLight_event_loop function is not getting called on remote node, i have put the debug point also. but that event is not generated.

3. Will this API be route the text msg on same  end point where my light application is working?

4. If Not please let me know where i am wrong in implementing it.

5. I have to make another application on Separate  endpoint where serial application works, but ZCL layer will not route that msg to an endpoint so I am using same Endpoint, so please provide me suggestion or links or pdf or hint to implement such.

thanks 

Manish

Do you use Ubiqua Packet Analyzer to check if your text message is sent out from device node first?

Hello sir,

1. I Don't have Ubiqua but when i Am sending ZCL_on/off command it is going from the same to same endpoint where i have written application for RF to serial receive  function but when i am sending the text msg event is not generating.

2. That is why i asking you some code snippet or refer links so that i can know about my mistakes.

Thanks and regards

Manish

Try to add the following red line in zcl_event_loop().

      if ( *msgPtr == AF_INCOMING_MSG_CMD )
      {
        zcl_ProcessMessageMSG( (afIncomingMSGPacket_t *)msgPtr );

        osal_msg_send( zclYourApplicaiton_TaskID, msgPtr );
      }

And you should receive AF_INCOMING_MSG_CMD in your zclYourApplication_event_loop().

Hello Yikai Sir,

I want to test OTA  and want to know How OTA happens in Zigbee, How to send the Frame Format from One node to other from controller to Router. can you please help .

I have gone through the OTA apps in Home Automation but did'nt find the way to integrate the same in My app. Can you please suggest the Testing Procedure or any refrence doc on it?

Thanks and Regards

Manish