TINA-TI: Fail to create a macro and encounter convergence problem or irregular circuits

Yubing

Part Number: TINA-TI
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: REF6050

Hi TI experts,

I am using TINA-TI simulating circuits and I have encounterred several problems.

1. I want to simulate an LED driver driving SFH4713A. However, I failed to create a macro using the model downloaded from part supplier. TINA-TI shows 'Invalid device. Line:#20. The circuit cannot be opened or cannot be converted to a macro.' Please find the attached .lib file below. How can I solve this problem? Attaced is the .lib file.

OSRAM-IR-OSLON.lib

2. I cannot create a macro for part REF6050 using the .lib file downloaded from TI. Attaced is the .lib file downloaded from TI.

ref6050 spice model-sbom994.zip

3. In order to simulate a more realistic situation, I prefer to include decoupling capacitors in schematics, as shown below. In addition, I insert am ampere meter in the current loop. However, TINA-TI usually encounters 'Convergence problem' or 'Irregular circuits' so that I have to abort simulation. How can I solve this problem? Attaced is the .TSC file.

SNOM619A-LMG1020 TINA-TI reference design.TSC

over 4 years ago

0 LeonardEllis over 4 years ago

TI__Guru 71526 points

Hello user5961808,

Thank you for your inquiry about TINA. Since TINA is a DesignSoft/TINA program, questions are best handled by using the DesignSoft support page: http://www.tina.com/technical-support/ .

The DesignSoft/TINA team is very helpful and this is the most direct way for TINA support. Please advise by Reply when the issue has been resolved.

Regards,

~Leonard

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to LeonardEllis

Intellectual 465 points

Thanks for you help.

0 kai klaas69 over 4 years ago

Guru 140200 points

Hi,

choose a smaller time window:

Kai

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to kai klaas69

Intellectual 465 points

Hi Kai,

Thanks for your reply.

Attached is another simulation file. I changed VG1 to piecewise linear type and the time window is set to be 2us. Still TINA encounterred irregular circuit. But if I choose 1us time window, then it's OK. So, how should I choose the time window, instead of blindly guessing?

TINA-TI reference design-piecewise linear source&2us.TSC

In addition, though using 1us time window TINA can simulate the circuit, it seems the result is wrong (the result is very similar to your posted picture). You should see the amplitude of load current is on order of fA. But qualitative analysis tell us the load current should have an amplitude of 20A (20V/1ohm). If we delete D2, the result becomes right. Why?

Looking forward to your reply.

Thanks.

Yubing

0 kai klaas69 over 4 years ago in reply to Yubing

Guru 140200 points

Hi,

you have made a drawing mistake arround D2. "Using initial conditions" in the "transient analysis", I get the following result:

In your second simulation there's the same drawing mistake. I get the following simulation result, when I increase the "internal resistance" of "V2" from 0R to 5mR:

Kai

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to kai klaas69

Intellectual 465 points

Hi Kai,

Thanks for your support.

Why do we have to increase the internal resistance of V2? In TI's reference design, the internal resistance is 0.

0 kai klaas69 over 4 years ago in reply to Yubing

Guru 140200 points

Hi,

well, from time to time simulators don't like ideal components... :-)

To be honest, sometimes lots of trial and error is necessary when "running" TINA-TI, especially if the circuit is as complex as yours with this decoupling cap armada.

Kai

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to kai klaas69

Intellectual 465 points

Thanks for your support. This really helps me a lot.

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to kai klaas69

Intellectual 465 points

Hi Kai,

One more question. I cannot create a macro of REF6050 using the .lib file downloaded from TI.com. TINA says the file is empty. Can you try this on your side?

SBOM994-ref6050.ZIP

0 kai klaas69 over 4 years ago in reply to Yubing

Guru 140200 points

Hi,

open the REF6050 TINA-TI Reference Design

Then, copy and paste the model of REF6050 into your simulation.

By the way, the model of REF6050 is encrypted:

Kai

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to kai klaas69

Intellectual 465 points

Hi,

I have been using the TINA reference design to simulate the part. My question is why can't I insert the part by "Tool'--->'New macro wizard', which I think is the standard procedure? Is it because the .lib file is encrypted?

In addition, do you know how to measure the noise of a voltage reference? As far as I know, noise of a state-of-art oscilloscope equiped with 10X passive probe is on order of millivolts. How did TI experts measure the microvolt noise?

0 kai klaas69 over 4 years ago

Guru 140200 points

Hi,

yes, I think this is the reason.

Referring to your noise voltage measurement question, see this link:

http://www.ti.com/tool/TIPD147

Kai

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to kai klaas69

Intellectual 465 points

Thanks a lot for your support.

0 kai klaas69 over 4 years ago in reply to Yubing

Guru 140200 points

You are welcome :-)

Kai

0 Yubing over 4 years ago in reply to kai klaas69

Intellectual 465 points

Hi,

When simulating the AC transfer characteristic of an op amp, the resulted bode plot is for small signal whose amplitude is lower than 0.1mVp-p, right?

What about the bode plot for large signals? I currently manually sweep the frequency of input signal and simulate the transient response of the op amp and than measure the amplitude of output at each freqency.

0 kai klaas69 over 4 years ago in reply to Yubing

Guru 140200 points

Hi,

yes, I do it in the same way.

You might also want to read this thread:

Kai

Amplifiers

Amplifiers forum

TINA-TI: Fail to create a macro and encounter convergence problem or irregular circuits