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TL074: How constant is TL074's output resistance?

Guru 20035 points
Other Parts Discussed in Thread: TL074, OPA827, OPA627

Hello,

How constant is TL074's output resistance?  What parameters affect it?

Stephen

  • Could someone at TI please answer this question.
    Thanks,
    Stephen
  • Hi Stephen,

    The TL074 is an older device and the output impedance wasn't directly specified in the product datasheet.  That said, a functional block diagram for the device is provided in Section 8.2 which shows that the device features a classic common emitter output stage.  Similar devices, such as the OPA627 and OPA827 feature flat resistive output impedances over frequency.  Therefore, I would expect something similar for the TL074.  Since there look to be a passive 128Ohm impedance directly in series with the output and also 64Ohm resistances in series with the transistor impedances, I would expect an open-loop output impedance between 160 and 250 Ohms.

  • Hello Collin,

    Thanks for the reply.

    According to e2e.ti.com/.../509322, the output impedance is given by Figure 6 in the TL074 datasheet.

    Is it ok to use the graph in figure 6?

    "Similar devices, such as the OPA627 and OPA827 feature flat resistive output impedances over frequency"
    Ok, that's good.

    Thanks,
    Stephen
  • Hello Collin,

    I still had one more question:
    According to e2e.ti.com/.../509322, the output impedance is given by Figure 6 in the TL074 datasheet.

    Is it ok to use the graph in figure 6 to compute TL074's output resistance?

    Thanks,
    Stephen
  • Hi Stephen,

    The graph in Figure 6 can be used to calculate the on resistance of the output transistors while in a saturated condition when the output is slammed to the rail of the supply. The output impedance when operating in a linear operating condition may be slightly different, but will likely be close to the 200Ohms calculated in the post you've linked to as suggested in my post above.
  • Hopefully, its not too low. I was hoping the op-amp current would limit the current through clamping diodes (to +3.3 and to 0V). The clamping diodes are rated at 200mA.
  • How low will can the TL074 output resistance go?
    Stephen
  • Hi Stephen,

    We don't have data to provide a firm answer to your question. That said, a -50% deviation from the expected value of 200 Ohms would likely provide more than enough margin to work with the TL074. So, if your system can survive with a 100 Ohm minimum open-loop output impedance then you'll likely be okay.
  • 100 ohms might be ok. Where do you get the -50% deviation?

    Our issue is that there is not too much room on the board to add another series resistor (it would require a significant change in layout).
  • Since we don't have any data to back up the claim our recommendation was to use an overly large deviation of -50% so your system is robust even it if changes by much less than that.

    I'm sure what you're asking for with all the current limit and extra resistor questions, but I'll add some additional information that may be helpful.  When the output is saturated you'll see the 200 Ohms of output impedance that was calculated in the posts you linked to originally.  

    When the op amp is operating in a linear condition the open-loop gain (Aol) of the amplifier is very large at low frequencies.  In a linear operating condition the closed-loop output impedance (Zout) presented to the load will equal the open-loop output impedance (Zo) divided by 1 + Aol*B, where B (Beta) is the feedback factor and Aol*B is the "Loop-Gain".  So for frequencies where the loop-gain is large the closed loop output impedance (Zout) will be small.  Lets take an example at 10Hz assuming the open-loop output impedance (Zo) is roughly 200 Ohms and the op-amp is configured in a unity-gain configuration so the loop-gain (Aol*B) is equal to Aol. Since Zout = Zo / 1+Aol*B we can solve for the closed-loop output impedance at 10Hz as shown:

    Zout = Zo / (1+Aol*B) = 200 / (1 + 200,000V/V) = 999uOhms (9.99E-4 Ohms). 

  • In my circuit, most of the op-amps feeding the ADC are in an inverting configuration.  

    According to .

    The output impedance in that type of configuration is equal to the Feedback resistor in parallel with the op-amps output resistance.  They assume the output resistance is constant.

    However, Equation 9.52 in the pdf at seems to more closely match what you said.

    What happens when the when the op-amp's output voltage exceeds the clamping diode voltage?  

    My circuit will be relying on the op-amp to limit the current through clamping diodes.  Also, I would like the current though the clamping diodes not to exceed 100mA.

    Stephen

  • Stephen,

    The nice thing about the TL074 is that the output resistance is set almost entirely by resistors.
    The TL074 output resistance should stay with 200 ohms, +/-15%
  • "The TL074 output resistance should stay with 200 ohms, +/-15%"

    Ok, that's good.

    "The nice thing about the TL074 is that the output resistance is set almost entirely by resistors."

    Do you mean internal op-amp resistors?

  • Yes, the resistor(s) are inside the package.